Print Page | Close Window

Do not respond to Jazz

Printed From: IslamiCity.com
Category: General
Forum Name: General Discussion
Forum Discription: General Discussion
URL: http://www.IslamiCity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2183
Printed Date: 16 September 2014 at 10:36am


Topic: Do not respond to Jazz
Posted By: Tasneem
Subject: Do not respond to Jazz
Date Posted: 05 September 2005 at 7:22pm

Peace to all who are here to share their knowledge of Islam and to those who are genuinely interested in learning about Islam.

I have just read some of the threads on this forum and in particular those posted by "Jazz". This person - Jazz has at times claimed that he does not belong to any religion and yet again you will find that he is very supportive of Christian beliefs. It seems that Jazz is highly committed to demonising Islam, driving away anyone who have any interest in Islam and to weaken the faith of the believers. I am reminded of the verse from Sura Ya-Sin:

036.008:Lo! We have put on their necks carcans reaching unto the chins, so that they are made stiff-necked.

036.009:And We have put a bar in front of them and a bar behind them, and further, We have covered them up; so that they cannot see.
036.010:The same is it to them whether thou admonish them or thou do not admonish them: they will not believe.

There are others who are also trying to strengthen Jazz's crusade by even completely denouncing the existence of God. In the past I too have answered to some of Jazz' challenges and he has shut up. But I notice that he constantly brings up new issues with the very obvious intention of demonisng Islam. This person may appear under different names, one could be "Silas". It would be best not to respond to him/her and a request to the moderators - it would be in the interest of Islamicity not to allow this person such a free reign.





Replies:
Posted By: Ason
Date Posted: 05 September 2005 at 7:32pm

notify the mods

let him be banned



Posted By: Jazz
Date Posted: 14 September 2005 at 3:41am
Originally posted by Tasneem

Peace to all who are here to share their knowledge of Islam and to those who are genuinely interested in learning about Islam.

I have just read some of the threads on this forum and in particular those posted by "Jazz". This person - Jazz has at times claimed that he does not belong to any religion and yet again you will find that he is very supportive of Christian beliefs.


Dear Tasneem,

Reading between the lines of what you are saying here, you seem to be implying that I am lying........would you be more specific and clearly point-out where this might be evident?

What makes you think I am "very supportive of Christian beliefs"?

I think much of the christian beliefs are based on people twisting and/or mis-interpreting what Jesus was ACTUALLY saying.

I think christian zealots have attempted to link Jesus to the Torah, claiming all these fantastic things, but I don't believe that Jesus claimed any of this himself.

Would you like to discuss this?

Originally posted by Tasneem

It seems that Jazz is highly committed to demonising Islam, driving away anyone who have any interest in Islam and to weaken the faith of the believers.

Dear Tasneem,
I have posted direct quotes from Quran and Ahadith, giving in most cases links to my sources which are recognized and accepted as authoritative Islamic web-sites...............islam "demonizes" itself.

Whether or not people are driven away is yet to be determined.......whether or not believers' faith is weakened or not is nothing to do with me, it is to do with their own condition or state of mind.

Originally posted by Tasneem

There are others who are also trying to strengthen Jazz's crusade by even completely denouncing the existence of God. In the past I too have answered to some of Jazz' challenges and he has shut up. But I notice that he constantly brings up new issues with the very obvious intention of demonisng Islam. This person may appear under different names, one could be "Silas". It would be best not to respond to him/her and a request to the moderators - it would be in the interest of Islamicity not to allow this person such a free reign.

Tasneem,

To start with, you haven't even established that I am on a "crusade" as you put it, yet you proceed to build your condemnation of me based merely on a suspicion that you harbour.

What have you said that has caused me to "shut-up"?.......I am happy to respond to your views, comments, opinion and arguments.........it is possible for me to not like what you have to say, but I have no desire to call for you or anyone else to be silenced by way of boycott, censorship or banning............what are you afraid of?

No Tasneem, I am not using any more than one user-name..........only "Jazz"

I don't know anyone here on the forum, nor am I with a team of people...........your suspicions are wrong.

I do have a genuine interest to lean about Islam, about people who call themselves muslim...........but I do so my way, not necessarily your way or to your liking.

Why should your being offended be more important than my being offended?

 


Posted By: Dayem
Date Posted: 14 September 2005 at 4:46am

HELL!!I just posted a reply to Jazz, meaning, wasted 30 mins!!

JAZZ:

What makes you think I am "very supportive of Christian beliefs"?

But I agree with tasneem, any fool with two eyes will realize that aftr reading ur replies.

"I have posted direct quotes from Quran and Ahadith, giving in most cases links to my sources which are recognized and accepted as authoritative Islamic web-sites...............islam "demonizes" itself."

What bout the answers??Dosnt these logical answer give u something to think about?

(Ah, 5 more mins wasted).



-------------
"the mooslims! they're heeere!"
LOONWATCH.COM


Posted By: Jazz
Date Posted: 16 September 2005 at 9:12pm
Originally posted by Dayem

HELL!!I just posted a reply to Jazz, meaning, wasted 30 mins!!

JAZZ:

What makes you think I am "very supportive of Christian beliefs"?

But I agree with tasneem, any fool with two eyes will realize that aftr reading ur replies.


For example?

Btw, According to Mohammed, Allah was supportive of popular christian beliefs, in fact more than I.

Not that his account of what was said by Jesus was the same as the accounts of those who ACTUALLY were companions of Jesus, but nevertheless supportive to some degree.

I think that many christian beliefs are based on invented stories of Jesus and I also think that much of Mohammed's beliefs are based these invented stories..........I don't think that many christians or Mohammed really understand what Jesus was REALLY saying and teaching, this is plain to see, when one compares the guidances of Mohammed and Jesus..........Jesus guided people to love, forgive and be merciful, clearly abrogating the inhumane "laws" of the Torah, whereas Mohammed's "revelations" from Allah reverted back to the old Toric inhumane "laws" - virtually going against the guidances of Jesus.

You see Dayen, I don't believe in the christian beliefs that Jesus was the only son of God, nor that he is God, nor that his mother had a virgin pregnancy, nor that he walked on water, nor that he rose from the dead, nor that he claimed to be a Jew, nor that he claimed to be a prophet, nor that he claimed to be the messiah.

Are you clear on this now?

Quran:

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=1320 - The Cow

  1. [2.87] And most certainly We gave Musa the Book and We sent apostles after him one after another; and We gave Isa, the son of Marium, clear arguments and strengthened him with the holy spirit, What! whenever then an apostle came to you with that which your souls did not desire, you were insolent so you called some liars and some you slew.
  2. [2.136] Say: We believe in Allah and (in) that which had been revealed to us, and (in) that which was revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Ishaq and Yaqoub and the tribes, and (in) that which was given to Musa and Isa, and (in) that which was given to the prophets from their Lord, we do not make any distinction between any of them, and to Him do we submit.
  3. [2.253] We have made some of these apostles to excel the others among them are they to whom Allah spoke, and some of them He exalted by (many degrees of) rank; and We gave clear miracles to Isa son of Marium, and strengthened him with the holy spirit. And if Allah had pleased, those after them would not have fought one with another after clear arguments had come to them, but they disagreed; so there were some of them who believed and others who denied; and if Allah had pleased they would not have fought one with another, but Allah brings about what He intends.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=72808 - The Family of Imran

  1. [3.45] When the angels said: O Marium, surely Allah gives you good news with a Word from Him (of one) whose name is the '. Messiah, Isa son of Marium, worthy of regard in this world and the hereafter and of those who are made near (to Allah).
  2. [3.52] But when Isa perceived unbelief on their part, he said Who will be my helpers in Allah's way? The disciples said: We are helpers (in the way) of Allah: We believe in Allah and bear witness that we are submitting ones.
  3. [3.55] And when Allah said: O Isa, I am going to terminate the period of your stay (on earth) and cause you to ascend unto Me and purify you of those who disbelieve and make those who follow you above those who disbelieve to the day of resurrection; then to Me shall be your return, so l will decide between you concerning that in which you differed.
  4. [3.59] Surely the likeness of Isa is with Allah as the likeness of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, Be, and he was.
  5. [3.84] Say: We believe in Allah and what has been revealed to us, and what was revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Ishaq and Yaqoub and the tribes, and what was given to Musa and Isa and to the prophets from their Lord; we do not make any distinction between any of them, and to Him do we submit.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=114839 - The Women

  1. [4.157] And their saying: Surely we have killed the Messiah, Isa son of Marium, the apostle of Allah; and they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them so (like Isa) and most surely those who differ therein are only in a doubt about it; they have no knowledge respecting it, but only follow a conjecture, and they killed him not for sure.
  2. [4.159] And there is not one of the followers of the Book but most certainly believes in this before his death, and on the day of resurrection he (Isa) shall be a witness against them.
  3. [4.163] Surely We have revealed to you as We revealed to Nuh, and the prophets after him, and We revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Ishaq and Yaqoub and the tribes, and Isa and Ayub and Yunus and Haroun and Sulaiman and We gave to Dawood
  4. [4.171] O followers of the Book! do not exceed the limits in your religion, and do not speak (lies) against Allah, but (speak) the truth; the Messiah, Isa son of Marium is only an apostle of Allah and His Word which He communicated to Marium and a spirit from Him; believe therefore in Allah and His apostles, and say not, Three. Desist, it is better for you; Allah is only one God; far be It from His glory that He should have a son, whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His, and Allah is sufficient for a Protector.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=158021 - The Dinner Table

  1. [5.46] And We sent after them in their footsteps Isa, son of Marium, verifying what was before him of the Taurat and We gave him the Injeel in which was guidance and light, and verifying what was before it of Taurat and a guidance and an admonition for those who guard (against evil).
  2. [5.78] Those who disbelieved from among the children of Israel were cursed by the tongue of Dawood and Isa, son of Marium; this was because they disobeyed and used to exceed the limit.
  3. [5.110] When Allah will say: O Isa son of Marium! Remember My favor on you and on your mother, when I strengthened you I with the holy Spirit, you spoke to the people in the cradle and I when of old age, and when I taught you the Book and the wisdom and the Taurat and the Injeel; and when you determined out of clay a thing like the form of a bird by My permission, then you breathed into it and it became a bird by My permission, and you healed the blind and the leprous by My permission; and when you brought forth the dead by My permission; and when I withheld the children of Israel from you when you came to them with clear arguments, but those who disbelieved among them said: This is nothing but clear enchantment.
  4. [5.112] When the disciples said: O Isa son of Marium! will your Lord consent to send down to us food from heaven? He said: Be careful of (your duty to) Allah if you are believers.
  5. [5.114] Isa the son of Marium said: O Allah, our Lord! send i down to us food from heaven which should be to us an ever-recurring happiness, to the first of us and to the last of us, and a sign from Thee, and grant us means of subsistence, and Thou art the best of the Providers.
  6. [5.116] And when Allah will say: O Isa son of Marium! did you say to men, Take me and my mother for two gods besides Allah he will say: Glory be to Thee, it did not befit me that I should say what I had no right to (say); if I had said it, Thou wouldst indeed have known it; Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I do not know what is in Thy mind, surely Thou art the great Knower of the unseen things.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=190943 - The Cattle

  1. [6.85] And Zakariya and Yahya and Isa and Ilyas; every one was of the good;

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=468143 - Marium

  1. [19.34] Such is Isa, son of Marium; (this is) the saying of truth about which they dispute.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=650389 - The Clans

  1. [33.7] And when We made a covenant with the prophets and with you, and with Nuh and Ibrahim and Musa and Isa, son of Marium, and We made with them a strong covenant

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=757449 - The Counsel

  1. [42.13] He has made plain to you of the religion what He enjoined upon Nuh and that which We have revealed to you and that which We enjoined upon Ibrahim and Musa and Isa that keep to obedience and be not divided therein; hard to the unbelievers is that which you call them to; Allah chooses for Himself whom He pleases, and guides to Himself him who turns (to Him), frequently.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=767330 - Ornaments of Gold

  1. [43.63] And when Isa came with clear arguments he said: I have come to you indeed with wisdom, and that I may make clear to you part of what you differ in; so be careful of (your duty to) Allah and obey me:

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=852181 - The Iron

  1. [57.27] Then We made Our apostles to follow in their footsteps, and We sent Isa son of Marium afterwards, and We gave him the Injeel, and We put in the hearts of those who followed him kindness and mercy; and (as for) monkery, they innovated it-- We did not prescribe it to them-- only to seek Allah's pleasure, but they did not observe it with its due observance; so We gave to those of them who believed their reward, and most of them are transgressors.

http://www.hti.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=DIV0&byte=874756 - The Ranks

  1. [61.6] And when Isa son of Marium said: O children of Israel! surely I am the apostle of Allah to you, verifying that which is before me of the Taurat and giving the good news of an Apostle who will come after me, his name being Ahmad, but when he came to them with clear arguments they said: This is clear magic.
  2. [61.14] O you who believe! be helpers (in the cause) of Allah, as~ Isa son of Marium said to (his) disciples: Who are my helpers in the cause of Allah? The disciples said: We are helpers (in the cause) of Allah. So a party of the children of Israel believed and another party disbelieved; then We aided those who believed against their enemy, and they became uppermost.

Originally posted by Dayem

"I have posted direct quotes from Quran and Ahadith, giving in most cases links to my sources which are recognized and accepted as authoritative Islamic web-sites...............islam "demonizes" itself."

What bout the answers??Dosnt these logical answer give u something to think about?

(Ah, 5 more mins wasted).

Dear Dayem,

Best advice I can offer is to don't waste your time, if you feel it is being wasted...........you have answers to your post(s), if you wish to read it/them.

Do you know what ad hominem means?

If you do, would you kindly argue or discuss the subject-matter, rather than go off on a tangent using ad hominem tactics?

 



Print Page | Close Window