Print Page | Close Window

Saudi Girl sentenced in own rape

Printed From: IslamiCity.com
Category: Culture & Community
Forum Name: Groups – Women (Sisters)
Forum Discription: Groups – Women (Sisters)
URL: http://www.IslamiCity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10716
Printed Date: 18 September 2014 at 12:47am


Topic: Saudi Girl sentenced in own rape
Posted By: Angela
Subject: Saudi Girl sentenced in own rape
Date Posted: 20 November 2007 at 2:30am
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15836746/ - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15836746/

(to Mod's - DO NOT MOVE)

Okay, this just sickens me.  Lots of women make st**id mistakes.  Cut across the dark parking lot to take a shortcut, accidently walk into a bad neighborhood, etc.  But what happened to personal responsibility.  Those men chose to rape her, whether she was there or not.  Its not like it was the man who was holding those photographs.  (Who btw, her attorney claims he was blackmailing the woman with)

This is a disgusting abuse of women.  We all here know its not in any way, shape or form Islamic.  You don't punish the victim for the crime.  And you don't double her punishment for daring to question the fairness of the judgment.

I feel so bad for this woman, hasn't she suffered enough for her poor choice.  Is beating her going to help?  And why are these men not on death row???? 



Replies:
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 20 November 2007 at 8:19am
being alone in a car with another man is a crime in Saudi Arabia.


In the case of the Girl of Qatif, she was sentenced to 90 lashes for being alone in a car with a man to whom she was not married


-------------


Posted By: Salams_wife
Date Posted: 20 November 2007 at 9:05am

The sad part is, this is nothing.  I read about a case in Pakistan where an old woman was raped by numerous police officers.  A few days earlier she had refused to rent an apartment she had to one of them.  So they came, arrested her, then took her to the police station where she was raped by numerous police officers for hours(she was a grandmother and a widow).  Later they even sodomized her.  They also stole her wedding Gold while she was there.  Then the court had the nerve to sentence her to prison for zina and of course, did nothing to the officers. 

My source for this comes from a book called Price of Honor by Jan Goodwin.  You would be suprised how many books are out there about this subject.  It really makes me sad, but you have to remember to look at the good too or I swear these things will make you depressed.



Posted By: truthseeker100
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 4:30am

Salam and hi,

I am a busy Muslim mother and a silent reader here most of the time.

It would be better to talk to Saudi Government officials or concerned authorities on this matter.

Any injustice against women or anyone anywhere should be strongly condemned.

But, why has focusing on only Saudi women become a norm?

In India, hundreds of thousands of female infanticides take place each year, but you don’t see that in the headlines. In many countries such as France, more than 25000 women are raped every year, you don’t see the headlines about that either. In USA, hundreds of thousands of women are raped each year, no cries are heard across the globe. Wrong is wrong no matter where it happens. But, I am amazed at the enormous disparity of attention. Whenever anything pertains to Saudi women or Muslim women where Muslim men are supposedly criminals, it becomes a world news, but elsewhere Muslim and non-Muslim women are being tortured and raped by non-Muslims and that goes unnoticed.

I am amazed at the enormous disparity of attention. 



-------------
And, behold, with every hardship comes ease:
Qur'an 94: 5


Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 6:37am
truth,

I complain about the female infanticides too.  I hate all systems that hurt women.  Even those in the US.  What's horrible about this one is her punishment was increased because she dared question the initial ruling?

I seem to remember the Quran having a prescribed punishment...its like 80 lashes.  So where is the 200 coming from....

I'll tell you...its not about what's Islamic.  The Islamic thing wasn't done here. 

This isn't an Issue of shariah, this is an issue of men who have their women cowed and try to hide behind the concept that its religious duty to keep them that way.

I have no illusion that what I see in Saudi Arabia is anyway shape or form what the Prophet (pbuh) intended when he gave women their rights back and protections.

The Prophet (pbuh) was a staunch defender of women, he may have chastised this girl for being so foolish to have been in the situation, but he would have never had her beaten for simply trying to get something the man shouldn't have had in the first place.

I am sick of watching women around the world victimized and then blamed for the incidents. 

In the US, rape happens.  Why don't you hear international outcry?  Because you don't see the women being taken into a public market and beaten for speaking up.  The crime here is the silence of so many victims and the stigma that people put on victims. 

There is outcry...the difference is there is also paths of justice, both for the victim and the accused.  Israfil can tell you, cops are taught how they should approach both victim and accused.

Also, you really can't compare country to country.  Rapes and such are in the news all the time here.  So they are common enough people get desensitized to it.  In foreign countries like Saudi Arabia that do not have free speech, sometimes these things become sensational because they aren't talked about so often.  The buzz gets picked up.

I posted a horrid article here not to long ago about the forced abortions going on in China.  Its about getting the stories out of the closed countries.  That's what makes them news worthy in a cynical society like the west.


-------------


Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 6:39am

Women are treated poorly all over the world!

Truthseeker.. I agree.. I think what makes it more diffcilut is that the woman is officially by the laws of the society as well. If someone is raped in many other countries they re not given punishment.. guess it is just shocking.. and its rare.. so its news... the experiences of thosands of women here are so common its not news.

people are such a mess!



-------------
When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi


Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 8:17am
In case you havent read the news carefully



That night, she said, she had left home to retrieve her picture from a male high school student she used to know. She had just been married — but had not moved in with her husband — and did not want her picture to remain with the student.

While the woman was in the car with the student, she said, two men intercepted them, got into the vehicle and drove the couple to a secluded area where the two were separated. She said she was raped by seven men, three of whom also allegedly raped her friend.


Apparently she was raped along with her boyfriend; why isn't anyone creating a fuss about her boyfriend?


-------------


Posted By: herjihad
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 8:50am

Salaams,

Originally posted by ak_m_f

In case you havent read the news carefully




That night, she said, she had left home to retrieve her picture from a male high school student she used to know. She had just been married — but had not moved in with her husband — and did not want her picture to remain with the student.

While the woman was in the car with the student, she said, two men intercepted them, got into the vehicle and drove the couple to a secluded area where the two were separated. She said she was raped by seven men, three of whom also allegedly raped her friend.


Apparently she was raped along with her boyfriend; why isn't anyone creating a fuss about her boyfriend?

Saudis defend punishment for rape victim

2 hours, 22 minutes ago

The Saudi judiciary on Tuesday defended a court verdict that sentenced a 19-year-old victim of a gang rape to six months in jail and 200 lashes because she was with an unrelated male when they were attacked.

The Shiite Muslim woman had initially been sentenced to 90 lashes after being convicted of violating Saudi Arabia's rigid Islamic law requiring segregation of the sexes.

But in considering her appeal of the verdict, the Saudi General Court increased the punishment. It also roughly doubled prison sentences for the seven men convicted of raping the woman, Saudi news media said last week.

The reports triggered an international outcry over the Saudis punishing the victim of a terrible crime.

But the Ministry of Justice stood by the verdict Tuesday, saying that "charges were proven" against the woman for having been in a car with a man who was not her relative.

The ministry implied the victim's sentence was increased because she spoke out to the press. "For whoever has an objection on verdicts issued, the system allows an appeal without resorting to the media," said the statement, which was carried on the official Saudi Press Agency.

The attack occurred in 2006. The victim says she was in a car with a male student she used to know trying to retrieve a picture of her. She says two men got into the car and drove them to a secluded area where she was raped by seven men. Her friend also was assaulted.

Justice in Saudi Arabia is administered by a system of religious courts according to the kingdom's strict interpretation of Islamic law.

Judges have wide discretion in punishing criminals, rules of evidence are vague and sometimes no defense lawyer is present. The result, critics say, are sentences left to the whim of judges. A rapist, for instance, could receive anywhere from a light sentence to death.

State Department spokesman Sean McCormack avoided directly criticizing the Saudi judiciary over the case, but said the verdict "causes a fair degree of surprise and astonishment."

"It is within the power of the Saudi government to take a look at the verdict and change it," McCormack said.

Canada's minister for women's issues, Jose Verger, has called the sentence "barbaric."

The New York-based Human Rights Watch said the verdict "not only sends victims of sexual violence the message that they should not press charges, but in effect offers protection and impunity to the perpetrators

Salaamu Alaykum,

Yes, of course, what happened to him is important and needs to be punished. 

But the most imporant and salient comment is in red.  This action "offers protection and impunity" to the perpetrators.

We have heard many, many stories, and I have heard a few stories from people I personally know, and I conclude easily without a doubt that the Saudi Kingdom doesn't regard protection of its women and men nearly as important as punishment and humiliation.  They have clearly said:  Rape our women and men if you catch them involved in the slightest impropriety.

May Allah, The Protector, protect and care for these rape victims.  Ameen.



-------------
Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.


Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 10:19am

Originally posted by Angela


(to Mod's - DO NOT MOVE)

Okay. I will do my best not to move this thread. Any action would be taken only if the thread becomes very much off-topic or/and many violations have taken place in that. But, please don’t ask this favor again as rules apply to everyone.  

P.S. You may also like to see relevant interpretation in the following link:

http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10721&PN=1 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10721&am p;PN=1



-------------
Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
Qur'an 55:13


Posted By: mariyah
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 6:00pm
Assalaau alaikum;
From MASNET.org Email:


Saudi Arabia: Rape Victim Punished for Speaking Out

Court Doubles Sentence for Victim, Bans Her Lawyer From the Case

(New York, November 17, 2007) – A court in Saudi Arabia doubled its sentence of lashings for a rape victim who had spoken out in public about her case and her efforts to seek justice, Human Rights Watch said today. The court also harassed her lawyer, banning him from the case and confiscating his professional license.

An official at the General Court of Qatif, which handed down the sentence on November 14, said the court had increased the woman’s sentence because of “her attempt to aggravate and influence the judiciary through the media.” The court sentenced the rape victim to six months in prison and 200 lashes, more than double its October 2006 sentence after its earlier verdict was reviewed by Saudi Arabia’s highest court, the Supreme Council of the Judiciary.  
 
Human Rights Watch called on King Abdullah to immediately void the verdict and drop all charges against the rape victim and to order the court to end its harassment of her lawyer.  
 
“A courageous young woman faces lashing and prison for speaking out about her efforts to find justice,” said Farida Deif, researcher in the women’s rights division of Human Rights Watch. “This verdict not only sends victims of sexual violence the message that they should not press charges, but in effect offers protection and impunity to the perpetrators.”  
 
The young woman, who is married, said she had met with a male acquaintance who had promised to give her back an old photograph of herself. After she met her acquaintance in his car in Qatif, a gang of seven men then attacked and raped both of them, multiple times. Despite the prosecution’s requests for the maximum penalty for the rapists, the Qatif court sentenced four of them to between one and five years in prison and between 80 and 1,000 lashes. They were convicted of kidnapping, apparently because prosecutors could not prove rape. The judges reportedly ignored evidence from a mobile phone video in which the attackers recorded the assault.  
 
Moreover, the court in October 2006 also sentenced both the woman and man who had been raped to 90 lashes each for what it termed “illegal mingling.” Human Rights Watch is particularly concerned that the criminalization of any contact between unmarried individuals of the opposite sex in Saudi Arabia severely impedes the ability of rape victims to seek justice. A court may view a woman’s charge of rape as an admission of extramarital sexual relations (or “illegal mingling”) unless she can prove, by strict evidentiary standards, that this contact was legal and the intercourse was nonconsensual.  
 
In an interview in December, the rape victim described to Human Rights Watch her treatment in court:  
     
    “At the first session, [the judges] said to me, ‘what kind of relationship did you have with this individual? Why did you leave the house? Do you know these men?’ They asked me to describe the situation. They used to yell at me. They were insulting. The judge refused to allow my husband in the room with me. One judge told me I was a liar because I didn’t remember the dates well. They kept saying, ‘Why did you leave the house? Why didn’t you tell your husband [where you were going]?’”  
 
“Victims of sexual violence in Saudi Arabia face enormous obstacles in the criminal justice system,” said Deif. “Their interrogations and court hearings are more likely to compound the trauma of the original assault than provide justice.”  
 
During the recent hearings, Judge al-Muhanna of the Qatif court also banned the woman’s lawyer, Abd al-Rahman al-Lahim, from the courtroom and from any future representations of her, without apparent reason. He also confiscated his lawyer’s identification card, which the Ministry of Justice issues. Al-Lahim faces a disciplinary hearing at the Ministry of Justice on December 5, where sanctions can include suspension for three years and disbarment.  
 
Al-Lahim, who is Saudi Arabia’s best-known human rights lawyer, earlier this year had planned to take legal action against the Ministry of Justice for failing to provide him with a copy of the verdict against his client so that he could prepare an appeal. Despite numerous representations to the court and the ministry, he was not given a copy of the case file or the verdict.  
 
“The decision to ban the rape victim’s lawyer from the case shows what little respect Saudi authorities have for the legal profession or the law in general,” said Sarah Leah Whitson, Middle East director at Human Rights Watch.  
 
On October 3, King Abdullah announced a judicial reform, promising new specialized courts and training for judges and lawyers. There is currently no rule of law in Saudi Arabia, which does not have a written penal code. Judges do not follow procedural rules and issue arbitrary sentences that vary widely. Often, judges do not provide written verdicts, even in death penalty cases. Judges sometimes deny individuals their right to legal representation. In May 2006, a judge in Jeddah had thrown a lawyer out of his courtroom in a civil suit on the sole basis that he is of the Isma’ili faith, a branch of Shiism. Trials remain closed to the public.  



Related Material

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2007/07/18/saudia16399.htm - Saudi Arabia: Officials Harass Forcibly Divorced Couple
Press Release, July 17, 2007

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2006/10/31/saudia14483.htm - Saudi Arabia: Lift Gag-Order on Rights Campaigner


This does not seem Islamic at all...In the case of condemning someone to lashes according to Quranic Dictate, Where are the 3 to 4 witnesses? It is sad to see the keeper of the Holy Places give such an example to the world. But again there are things we do not know it was a closed hearing, But Allah subanallah wa'taala sees all, and if there is a grave misjustice here, they will have to answer for it.




-------------
"Every good deed is charity whether you come to your brother's assistance or just greet him with a smile.


Posted By: Salams_wife
Date Posted: 21 November 2007 at 6:21pm

As far as I am concerned, there is never an excuse to rape a woman.  It does not matter if she walked down the street with hardly any clothing on.  It never gives any man the right to force himself on any woman.  If he actually believes he can, then he should be put into a mental institution and have his sanity checked.  I will not even get started on how I feel about using young boys in the wrong way.  That is just sick.

Even if many countries, even the United States, fail the punish rapists properly.  I know rapists still have to face their misdeads on the day of judgement.  Every good muslim man knows the only person he should be with is his wife.  No other person is allowed for him, so there is never an excuse for relations outside the marriage.  Whether the woman, man or child consents or not. 



Posted By: Cassandra
Date Posted: 22 November 2007 at 3:17am

It seems to me that this thread has been dealing more with the outrage we all should feel when someone is violated (female or male) and less to do with this specific case (and by implication any other which would follow this precedent, and of course, those which have come before).

The woman was gang raped for breaking a law which seems to most of us (I sincerely hope) archaic and discriminatory.  That we know.

She made a very foolish mistake, and is paying for it out of all proportion to the deed.

But it is the sentence itself which is the topic we should be addressing, not only because she was the victim, but also because when she tried to establish her rights as a human female, her sentence was increased even more!  Not surprisingly, most of the world will condemn this.

But, we are not finished yet...her lawyer, who, clearly taking his responsibilities as a first line of defence, was not only chastised severely, but has had his livelihood taken away from him.

What possible sense can any of us make about this?

And while I am about it: Today, on the news, I see that there has been "outrage" in the US.  Hillary Clinton is quoted as saying she will make human rights a priority "when" she becomes President.  Hillary, get involved NOW, and stop using this poor woman´s tragedy and the very shame we feel - as human beings when reading of the terrible injustices perpetrated in a country populated with too many hypocritical men - as an electioneeering ploy.

No doubt the last paragraph will get deleted.  But do comment, please.

 



Posted By: herjihad
Date Posted: 22 November 2007 at 5:00am
Originally posted by Cassandra

It seems to me that this thread has been dealing more with the outrage we all should feel when someone is violated (female or male) and less to do with this specific case (and by implication any other which would follow this precedent, and of course, those which have come before).

The woman was gang raped for breaking a law which seems to most of us (I sincerely hope) archaic and discriminatory.  That we know.

She made a very foolish mistake, and is paying for it out of all proportion to the deed.

But it is the sentence itself which is the topic we should be addressing, not only because she was the victim, but also because when she tried to establish her rights as a human female, her sentence was increased even more!  Not surprisingly, most of the world will condemn this.

But, we are not finished yet...her lawyer, who, clearly taking his responsibilities as a first line of defence, was not only chastised severely, but has had his livelihood taken away from him.

What possible sense can any of us make about this?

And while I am about it: Today, on the news, I see that there has been "outrage" in the US.  Hillary Clinton is quoted as saying she will make human rights a priority "when" she becomes President.  Hillary, get involved NOW, and stop using this poor woman´s tragedy and the very shame we feel - as human beings when reading of the terrible injustices perpetrated in a country populated with too many hypocritical men - as an electioneeering ploy.

No doubt the last paragraph will get deleted.  But do comment, please.

 

Salaams,

Why would the paragraph about Hilary get deleted?  I don't care what Hilary says anyway.  She's just another paid politician.

I would like to hear what the Saudis are saying to each other in their living rooms about this.  I imagine many moms and dads think that their daughters and sons would never be caught out breaking the law, but maybe a few realize that their daughters and sons are vulnerable, and would like to make changes, but they don't have the power to do so.  How could we help them?  I have no idea.  Prayers for sure.



-------------
Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.


Posted By: Cassandra
Date Posted: 22 November 2007 at 6:24am

Hillary is safe enough (so far); it's the Saudi hosts of this Forum I worry about!!!

Salaams to you too.....

Cassi



Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 23 November 2007 at 1:08am

  I have come across many incidents like this across the muslim world,where victims are further victimised.I am not an expert in shariah but i wonder if the girl here hasn't suffered enough[or more] for her mistake.I mean rape; is the most traumatic experience a girl could go through.Its the same for boys too.I also wonder why the rapists weren't stoned to death.Is this the judgement Prophet Muhammad[pbuh] would have handed out for this case?



-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 04 December 2007 at 3:22am
I agree, Saladin.

My outrage at this stuff knows no bounds.  There is a case going before the Supreme Court here in the US in the future.  Louisiana has a law on the books that allows for the death penalty for a rapist of a child.  Its finally been handed out and the rapist is fighting it. 

I pray that the Supreme Court upholds this sentence and it encourages other states to enact this law on their books.  Maybe if the rapists and child molesters faced death for their crimes against women and children they would think twice before they commit these crimes.

I think its too easy to blame the victims.  I had a friend who was raped.  The cops treated her poorly and it was never fully investigated because she had been longtime friends with the man and she had gone to his dorm room to visit him.  They didn't believe her that she had said no and that he forced her.  She was made to feel like a harlot and she was a good girl.  She was not someone who did those kind of things.

Question for us as women/society is, how do we protect our daughters from this kind of thing?  Obviously, forced segregation doesn't work?  Neither does feminist rhetoric about empowerment?

Really, I think the focus needs to be on the men, not the women.


-------------


Posted By: herjihad
Date Posted: 04 December 2007 at 10:20am
Originally posted by Angela

I agree, Saladin.

My outrage at this stuff knows no bounds.  There is a case going before the Supreme Court here in the US in the future.  Louisiana has a law on the books that allows for the death penalty for a rapist of a child.  Its finally been handed out and the rapist is fighting it. 

I pray that the Supreme Court upholds this sentence and it encourages other states to enact this law on their books.  Maybe if the rapists and child molesters faced death for their crimes against women and children they would think twice before they commit these crimes.

I think its too easy to blame the victims.  I had a friend who was raped.  The cops treated her poorly and it was never fully investigated because she had been longtime friends with the man and she had gone to his dorm room to visit him.  They didn't believe her that she had said no and that he forced her.  She was made to feel like a harlot and she was a good girl.  She was not someone who did those kind of things.

Question for us as women/society is, how do we protect our daughters from this kind of thing?  Obviously, forced segregation doesn't work?  Neither does feminist rhetoric about empowerment?

Really, I think the focus needs to be on the men, not the women.


Salaamu Alaykum Sista Angela,

I agree with your outrage. I strongly believe the focus needs to be on eradicating the wrong idea that people are no longer pure when they have been raped.  Raped people are shunned in America as well, especially when they are pursuing a case against someone in their community.  And we've heard the stories of people becoming outcasts in Bosnia, Serbia, South American countries, Africa, just all over.

In this story, a young man was raped/sodomized as well by that group of people.  We need to protect ourselves from the evil in this world by continuing to love and respect people who have been attacked and not blaming the victims.  I wholeheartedly agree that this Sister, we need to remember, has suffered too much already.  What was the fate of the young man?  We need to be lobbying Saudi to free and apologize to both of them, and to investigate why the punishment in such a strict, overbearing country, was comparatively light for these rapists?  Were they well-connected guys maybe?


-------------
Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.


Posted By: Salams_wife
Date Posted: 04 December 2007 at 1:11pm

Though this doesn't solve the problem of rape, I have a few precautions I take if I must be out alone.  If it is legal where I am, I often carry a small pocket knife.  I also took some self defense classes so I can protect myself.  It wouldn't save you if you are attacked by seven men, but against one at least you have a chance. 

It is tought over and over again that the women most likely to be attacked are the ones who appear weaker to the attacker.  Most rapists prefer to pick vulnerable women.  There are many websites out there on things women can do to protect themselves from rape.  Also, the vast majority of the rapes in America are conducted by known family members and friends.  This is where being able to defend yourself would help a lot.  I don't know if laws will ever be changed to truly effect change, but I do believe there are ways to protect ourselves.  The more you convince a man he is up for the fight of his life if he attacks you, the less likely you are to become a victim.  This is my suggestion, but of course there are many ways to protect yourself. 



Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 05 December 2007 at 3:50am

The more you convince a man he is up for the fight of his life if he attacks you, the less likely you are to become a victim. 

Salams Wife, you are correct. I'd love to know where you took your classes. :) I teach self-defense here in Wash DC.

And yes most people are Attacked by someone they know. And being attacked by more than one assailant is not that common for women.

In one of our programs, there was a woman who was in the middle of the course, it is 25 hours, full-force self-defense, she was about 2/3 the way through. She was attacked by three men, she had her baby and a toddler. She knocked them all out



-------------
When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi


Posted By: Salams_wife
Date Posted: 05 December 2007 at 1:58pm

Hayfa, that is really great that you teach the self-defense classes.  I wish all women would go to those.  It is also encouraging what you said about one of your students.  I think when women are tought techniques to defend themselves then it empowers them to try to save themselves and gives them more confidence.

I took my classes through one of the Royce Gracie schools for Brazilian Jiu Jitsu.  It is amazing what they can teach you to do no matter how small you are or how strong.



Posted By: Huzi
Date Posted: 13 December 2007 at 9:55pm

Salam alaykum,


Regarding the misinformation that the men who committed rape were given lesser sentence and allowed to let go free, but the fact is they have been given between 80 to 1000 lashes and sentences between one and five years each. Later their sentences were increased to between two to eleven years. This can be verified from http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=498849&in_page_id=1879 - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in _article_id=498849&in_page_id=1879


In most of the articles I have read on BBC, CNN etc they have only mentioned the sentence being given to the girl and no mentioning about the sentencing of the rapist and also no mentioning on what was the justification of the judges in giving the sentence to the girl. We become emotional and feel that injustice is being done based on these biased views. The reason why that girl was awarded the lashing was she was in indecent condition having taken off her clothes and her indecent condition was the reason why the Rape took place.


If one has to believe and obey the word of Allah then it is stated in Quran

Sura 24 An-Nur Ayah 2: The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication,- flog each of them with a hundred stripes: Let not compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day: and let a party of the Believers witness their punishment.


So if any one says that injustice is being done after knowing that she was found to be in indecent condition and guilty of lewdness then that injustice goes to Allah. These judges are also human beings and Allah fearing and they are nothing to gain when that girls, her male accomplice and the rapist are being flogged. But still Saudi judiciary stood by its decision inspite of international outcry just to follow the commands of Almighty.


And I do believe that the judges on board who awarded the sentence are Allah fearing and wouldn’t tell a lie to prove their case. They are more fearfull because they know that if they have given a wrong judgement then they would be accountable toward Allah on the day of Judgement. Allah subanallah wa'taala sees all, and if there is a grave misjustice here, they will have to answer for it. If one hears the girls account of why she met that man alone in a lonely place proves that she has made up a false story. It is hard to believe that she gave her snap to a man just because that man was threatening her on phone. Infact if any girl who gets threatening calls, she would complain to her parent or report it to police. Also no girl would get ready to go alone with any men in her car who was threatening her. She made this story to hide her illicit relationship with that men inspite of being married. Having said that I feel that her punishment shouldn’t have been doubled for appealing the previous judgment.

Please go through these links for the clarification given by saudi ministry of justice on the case
http://www.spa.gov.sa/English/details.php?id=501785 - http://www.spa.gov.sa/English/details.php?id=501785
http://www.spa.gov.sa/English/details.php?id=502890 - http://www.spa.gov.sa/English/details.php?id=502890


Finally I would like to point out that this is just one case where people out of emotion feel injustice is being done because of the baised views presented by media. What about injustice melted out to millions of Innocent people who were killed by ASS-HOLE BUSH? What about Injustice to innocent muslims being put in prison just on the basis of suspicion and the inhuman treatment melted out to them at Abu Ghraib?
 

Was-Salam
Huzefa



Posted By: Angel
Date Posted: 14 December 2007 at 4:34am

The case has gone to the high courts.

The girl wasn't married yet, she went to get the photo of her from her friend before getting married, what turned out as an innocent act, despite what she did was not lawful, she did pay the punishment, but the most outcry was because she exercised her right and then was given extra punishment for it, it is also noted that if the girls attorney was to appeal the girl would get triple the punishment. I haven't heard any more on that bit about the triple punishment, since it has gone to the high courts..

In one of the local magazines, WHO: december 17, 2007, it is noted:

"Saudi Arabian justice officals tells a story of a woman who was in the act of "illegal mingling" when she was abducted and raped by seven men. But the woman, known as the "Girl of Qatif" (she hails from the town in eastern Saudi Arabia), tells a different story. In 2006, the woman, 19, met a friend inhis car in Qatif to retrieve a photo of herself  she had given the man before she has become engaged. Then, "two people got out of [a] car and stood on either side of our car," she told human rights campaigner Farida deif. "The man on my side had a knife. I screamed." The men took them both to a building where five other men were waiting. Over several hours the pair were repeatedly raped by the seven men. What proved to be as shocking and incomprehensible as the crime itsefl was that, along with her assailants, who recieved jail terms, the Girl of Qatif, now 20, was on Nov.14 also handed a punishment. For being alone with a man not related to her, she was sentenced to 90 lashes. She appealed, but her sentence was increased to 200 lashes and six months' prison. After the sentence sparked a worldwide outcry, Saudi foreign minister Prince Saudi al-Faisal told reporters the case will now go before the "highest courts." Human-rights campaigner Ali Alyami told The New York Times: "The system has to be transformed from top to botom."

Anyway who survives that amount of lashings?



-------------
~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~


Posted By: Angel
Date Posted: 14 December 2007 at 5:15am

Originally posted by Huzi

and also no mentioning on what was the justification of the judges in giving the sentence to the girl.

from what i've gathered it is illegal to be alone with a man who is not your relative, so she got punishment for that. Second the extra punishment there is no justification and shouldn't have happened, if people have a right to exercise their rights then there should be no aftermath for it.

her indecent condition was the reason why the Rape took place.

I highly doubt that is the reason. Some people need to be seriously educated!!

I do have to question why there were seven men waiting ??

If one hears the girls account of why she met that man alone in a lonely place proves that she has made up a false story.

why would she make up a story of being repeatedly raped and so was her friend, its not just her story it is also the guy's. Something like that would traumise you. There were men waiting for god's sake!

It is hard to believe that she gave her snap to a man just because that man was threatening her on phone. Infact if any girl who gets threatening calls, she would complain to her parent or report it to police. Also no girl would get ready to go alone with any men in her car who was threatening her. She made this story to hide her illicit relationship with that men inspite of being married.

Not everyone goes to their parents or the police when being threatened.

From what I gather she was friends with the guy before being engaged, whatever form of relationship it was, I will not speculate like some of you guys do. Often people (any people) will exchange photos of each other, why is it so hard to image that is what went down, why do some of you have to image that something else went down instead, were you in the car with them?? 

Having said that I feel that her punishment shouldn’t have been doubled for appealing the previous judgment.

I'm glad you said that.

 



-------------
~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~


Posted By: Salams_wife
Date Posted: 14 December 2007 at 5:54am

There are a couple questions that keep running through my mind about this case.

1.  How do they know they girl was indecently dressed.  Are they relying on the rapists as witnesses to that?  I have not read of any witnesses outside the victims and the rapists.

2.  I also wonder if the boy in the car was convicted for being alone with a non-woman relative.  It seems to me he should be getting the same punishment as the girl originally recieved.  Especially since you can really put the original blame of this whole incident on him.  If he had never contacted the girl, none of this would have happened.

I also wonder, like Angel, how those guys knew and were waiting for them.  The whole case seems suspicious to me, but I am not in the court so maybe we are misssing some details.



Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 15 December 2007 at 6:44am

You know, I wonder if she got a harsher sentence because she's Shia and not Sunni?

I also recently read that her husband has been working very hard on her defense.  What husband would do that if his wife had been naked in a car with another man?  I think he believes his wife that she was only retrieving the photograph and was being blackmailed.

Who knows...Only Allah.  All of these people will face their judgements.

Oh, and Angel, the beatings are done a few at a time over a period of several weeks, she's not getting all 200 lashes at the same time and the method they use does not break skin.  So its not like the Slaves of the American south.  Many of them died from flogging because of infection from the open wounds left by the bull whip.  Still, to my western mindset, its still barbaric to beat a rape victim extra for speaking to the media.  Quran says 80 lashes...why is she getting 200, that's my question, I though the Quran was the final law.



-------------


Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 16 December 2007 at 6:45am
Originally posted by Angela

You know, I wonder if she got a harsher sentence because she's Shia and not Sunni?

I also recently read that her husband has been working very hard on her defense.  What husband would do that if his wife had been naked in a car with another man?  I think he believes his wife that she was only retrieving the photograph and was being blackmailed.

Who knows...Only Allah.  All of these people will face their judgements.

Oh, and Angel, the beatings are done a few at a time over a period of several weeks, she's not getting all 200 lashes at the same time and the method they use does not break skin.  So its not like the Slaves of the American south.  Many of them died from flogging because of infection from the open wounds left by the bull whip.  Still, to my western mindset, its still barbaric to beat a rape victim extra for speaking to the media.  Quran says 80 lashes...why is she getting 200, that's my question, I though the Quran was the final law.

"You know, I wonder if she got a harsher sentence because she's Shia and not Sunni?"

Angela, while I don’t doubt your good intention, such statements without any evidence can easily cause discords among people. Islam forbids us to speculate without any evidence.

There is already a thread on this topic in the Current Events:

Anyone interested to continue to discuss this matter can take part there:

Rape victim gets 200 lashes



-------------
Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
Qur'an 55:13



Print Page | Close Window