Active TopicsActive Topics  Display List of Forum MembersMemberlist  CalendarCalendar  Search The ForumSearch  HelpHelp
  RegisterRegister  LoginLogin  Old ForumOld Forum  Twitter  Facebook
Advertisement:
         

Islam for non-Muslims
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Islam for non-Muslims
Message Icon Topic: How did Jesus die Post Reply Post New Topic
<< Prev Page  of 12 Next >>
Author Message
believer
 
Guest Group
Guest Group


Joined: 08 January 2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1397
Quote believer Replybullet Posted: 26 June 2008 at 3:33pm
Mark 15
 
44Pilate was surprised to hear that he was already dead. Summoning the centurion, he asked him if Jesus had already died. 45When he learned from the centurion that it was so, he gave the body to Joseph.
 
 
4:157 That they said, "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of God.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
 
The Jews didn't crucify Jesus the Romans did.
 
Because He was alive sitting at the right hand of GOD
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
IP IP Logged
honeto
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 20 March 2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2446
Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 27 June 2008 at 6:17pm
believer,
your Bible suggests that Romans did not have anything to do with the so called killing or crucifixion of Jesus (pbuh), it was the Jews who were after him to kill him.
And as far as propht Jesus sitting on the right hand of God, that will make God sitting on the left side of Jesus, so I don't think you should take it litrally. Besides God is not a physical being, to be limited to left or right.
 
The final Testament, the Quran, confirms that God raised Jesus (pbuh) up to Himself. (So, yes we beleive that he is with God in the company or the righteous.)  And God saved him from the humiliation Jews were planning.
 
Hasan


Edited by honeto - 27 June 2008 at 6:22pm
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
IP IP Logged
minuteman
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member


Joined: 25 March 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1642
Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 27 June 2008 at 9:00pm
 
 Good point hasan, sitting on the right side and thus God being on the left side of Jesus. I hope one day the christians will come to real words and less metaphors (symbols). If one is sitting on the right side and the other (God) on the right side then that makes it two persons too?????
 
 Hasan, you are right. It was not the Romans trying to kill Jesus. It was his own people (The Jews). Pilate wanted to release Jesus. But the Jews did not allow. They shouted at the top of their voice to Crucify Jesus.
 Why Crucify Jesus?? The charge was balsphemy and the punishment for blasphemy in the bible OT is stoning to death (not crucifixtion). Why they were adamant that Jesus should be crucified?
 
 That is because they did not believe in him and wanted to prove him a false prophet (a cursed person). Jesus knew that too. That is why he prayed earnestly to avoid the cup.
 
 Also, Pilate wanted to release Jesus and Pilate had the message from his wife that He should have nothing to do with that pious man Jesus. The wife of Pilate believed that Jesus was a pious man and a man of God. She was visited by an angel who told her that Jesus should not be killed otherwise it would be bad for her and her family. So she passed that message to her husband not to harm Jesus.
 
 Would the husband (Governor Pilate) not listen to his wife?. Yes, he would. And Pilate did everything to save Jesus. Detail will be posted later.
 
 When angel visits a person to save Jesus, it means God does not want Jesus to be killed. When God does not want it then nobody can kill that person. I will give another example (later) of same thing related to the life (safety) of Jesus which will prove clearly that Jesus could not be killed on the cross because God did not want it.
 
 Jesus prayed hard in the garden. His sweat was running like blood. To avoid the humilating death on the cross. God accepted his prayer. That is clearly written in the Quran. It is also indicated in the bible too because it is written that an angel came to Jesus and that angel was strenghtening him. That means the angel was givng him hope of safety and approval (acceptance) of his prayers in the garden before arrest.
 
 (more later)...


Edited by minuteman - 27 June 2008 at 9:04pm
If any one is bad some one must suffer
IP IP Logged
minuteman
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member


Joined: 25 March 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1642
Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 03 July 2008 at 4:10am
 
 The other good example of Jesus safety is in the bible (Mathew 2:13). It is said that angel appeared to Joseph the father of Jesus after Jesus birth and told Joseph that the king (Herod) is an enemy of Jesus and would kill Jesus. So you take Jesus away to Egypt.
 
 Joseph did it. He took Jesus and Mary to Egypt and they lived there until Jesus was 12 years old. That was a God's safety plan for Jesus, i.e. to save Jesus. That was God's plan to save Jesus.
 
 Now, a question: Can any one believe that Jesus could die in Egypt by any cause, by snake bite etc or fever etc? Surely not. That is the answer. But let every one give their opinion. My reply is that Jesus could never have died in Egypt by any means because God (Allah) did not want Jesus to die.
 
 For the dream of Joseph and the visit of the angel please see mathew 2:13 onwards. It was the king Herod who wanted to kill Jesus.
 
 The important question is : Could Jesus die in Egypt by any cause? Please think and reply.


Edited by minuteman - 03 July 2008 at 4:14am
If any one is bad some one must suffer
IP IP Logged
Angel
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 03 July 2001
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6642
Quote Angel Replybullet Posted: 03 July 2008 at 7:08am
Could Jesus die in Egypt by any cause? Please think and reply.
 
(this isn't my personal view)
 
If God had a plan then He carried it out.
 
The question seems to be irrevelent anyway.
It seems you are trying to get to, that since God didn't have any plans for Jesus to be killed at his birth and in Egypt, then God must not have wanted Jesus to be killed at the time of the crufication. But if God had a plan for such a thing then He carried it out.
 
yes an angel came to Pilate's wife about leaving Jesus alone. But Pilate order it because of the crowd, as you say earlier Pilate tried all he could.
 
minuteman you meantioned "When God does not want it then nobody can kill that person." Well for me, if God did not want Jesus to be killed, then God had other opportunities between Pilate's order and the cross. God has the power right? Then why wasn't anything done to save him after Pilate's wife and the order? God saved Jesus when he was born and throught out egypt because Jesus had a mission to fulfill later in life, so Jesus had to have the chance to live.


Edited by Angel - 03 July 2008 at 7:10am
~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
IP IP Logged
minuteman
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member


Joined: 25 March 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1642
Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 03 July 2008 at 7:26am
 
  All that is a later thought and may be discussed later. I am only presenting the initial part that God sent an angel to Joseph and told him to take Jesus to Egypt because the king Herod intended to kill Jesus.
 
 Joseph acted on the advice. It is now a simple question to all friends to consider please. Could Jesus be killed in Egypt during his 12 years stay there by any means. That is my point now. Some suitable answer is required for that question. All are welcome.  Thanks.
If any one is bad some one must suffer
IP IP Logged
Angel
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 03 July 2001
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6642
Quote Angel Replybullet Posted: 03 July 2008 at 10:12am
I like to think he could have but he wasn't. I will repeat my answer, if you read you would have seen. Like I said If God had a plan then He carried it out. God saved Jesus when he was born and throught out egypt because Jesus had a mission to fulfill later in life, so Jesus had to have the chance to live.
 
~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
IP IP Logged
minuteman
 
Senior Member
Senior  Member


Joined: 25 March 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1642
Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 03 July 2008 at 6:48pm
 
 That is true. God always has a plan. When Joseph son of Jacob was thrown into  a pit, at that time also God had a plan. ( That was to save the entire Israeli nation). But that is beside the point. I agree that God had a plan for Jesus so He would not let him die.
 
 But we have not reached that point yet. We are just considering a simple situation. God advised Joseph to move Jesus into Egypt because the king Herod wanted to kill Jesus. So Joseph acted on the advice made known to him through the agency of an angel.
 
 He moved with son (Jesus) and wife (Mary) to Egypt and remained there for 12 years. Now I am considering only this point whether Jesus could be killed in Egypt by any cause such as fever or animal bite etc.
 
 My reply is no. For whatever reason, God may have had a plan for Jesus in future and for any other reason, that is yet beside the point, Jesus could not be killed in Egypt because if he did then the will of Allah will not be fulfilled (of keeping Jesus alive). Thanks for your posts.
If any one is bad some one must suffer
IP IP Logged
<< Prev Page  of 12 Next >>
Post Reply Post New Topic
Printable version Printable version

Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Disclaimer:
The opinions expressed herein contain positions and viewpoints that are not necessarily those of IslamiCity. This forum is offered to stimulate dialogue and discussion in our continuing mission of being an educational organization.
If there is any issue with any of the postings please email to icforum at islamicity.com or if you are a forum's member you can use the report button.

Note: The 99 names of Allah avatars are courtesy of www.arthafez.com

Advertisement:



Sponsored by:
Islamicity Membership Program:
IslamiCity Donation Program  http://www.islamicity.com/Donate
IslamiCity Arabic eLearning http://www.islamiCity.com/ArabAcademy
Complete Domain & Hosting Solutions www.icDomain.com
Home for Muslim Tunes www.icTunes.com
Islamic Video Collections www.islamiTV.com
IslamiCity Marriage Site www.icMarriage.com