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Interfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Interfaith Dialogue
Message Icon Topic: A question on the Quran(Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post Reply Post New Topic
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damaninchrist
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 6:12am
Originally posted by fatima

Bismillah irrahman irrahim

Iz kalati-lmalaikatou ya maryamou inna-llaha youbasshirouki bikalimatin minhou,

Im sure that as you claimed you know arabic and its grammatical chages, i wonder how you missed that this sentence has a pause here, then start again with

ismouhou-lmaseehou eesa-bnou maryama

Now if you read the ayah in arabic you will see a sukun on the letter Laa of almaseehou and in arabic language if you have a sukun on the word in the start it means you join it with with the word before if there is no break of phrase, So if you join two words together ismouhou-lmaseehou then it means HIS name will be Masih so what about the error?

How come you put a break before "ismouhou" when there's also a sukun on "ismou"?

"minhou" is connected to "ismouhou", correct?

So why did you force a break?



Edited by damaninchrist
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fatima
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 6:50am

Bismillah irrahman irrahim

and you say you know arabic? Anyway translate the ayah for me, will you?

Say: (O Muhammad) If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, MercifuL
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damaninchrist
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 7:50am
Originally posted by fatima

Bismillah irrahman irrahim

and you say you know arabic?

Yes.

Anyway translate the ayah for me, will you?

Ok ...

 

The angels said: "O Mary, Allah blesses you with good news with a word from Him, whose name is the Messiah Isa, son of Mary, outstanding in this world and the afterlife and one of the closest."

 

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Cyril
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 8:10am


There is apparently no break between "bikalimatin minhu" and "smuhu l-masHu".

The article "al" of masH looses its hamza with its "a" sound because of the "u" from smuhu.
It is shown in the Arabic script by the waSlah (=liaison) on top of the alif.

The same happens between the "u" of minhu and smu which has lost its initial hamza and "i" because of the "u" of hu.
Again it is shown by a waSlah on top of the alif of ism.

It could be "bikalimatin minhu smuh l-masH".

But as the Quran says smuhu so the pronoun must refer to the masculine name around which is al-masH.

I don't think it is a mistake. The choice was between smuh refering to al-kalimah or smuhu refering to al-masH. It is the second option which is written.

Strangely enough there is a similar "error" in the Arabic Gospel of John (1:1) where it says: "fil-bad'i kna (instead of knati) l-kalimatu".








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BMZ
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 9:14am

Apple Pie, oops, I mean Damanchrist,

From you: "Here, let me elaborate for the Arabic speaking people"

Elaborating for the Arabic-speaking people?   

Let me first edit your numerics within the translation of the verse!

"Iz kalatil-malaikato 'ya maryamo innal-laha yobash-shirokay bikalimatin minho-smohul-maseeho ee-sab-no maryama', wajeehan feed-dunya walakhirati wa minal-mukar-rabeena................."

Ismohu means whose name was or whose name is or whose name will be, simply his name.

The verse is not discussing the gender of the word or kalima.

"Innallaha yobashshirokay baykalimatum-minho" does NOT really mean "Surely God gives you the good news of a word from Him". That is the word-to-word translation. The nessage to Maryam simply means "O' Maryam, God gives you the good news of a son". That is all to that.

From you: "Notice the bolded part

hou is erroneously a masculine pronoun  when it should be feminine  since it's referring to "kalima" which is  feminine not masculine."

If Jesus, essabno maryama were a girl, it would not have been ismo-hu. Since Jesus was Mary's male child, we cannot say that her name was Jesus, the son of Mary.   

From you: "Oh, and no cheap replies, like "the Quran can never have grammar mistakes" because, unlike you, I don't assume that the Quran is perfect and that the Quran is exactly the same as the original. So spare me such replies, and just refute my point."

I am sure you would consider this scholarly reply proper in response to your cheap comments!  

Good Night from Singapore.

BMZ

 



Edited by bmzsp
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BMZ
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 9:36am

Hey,

Can you post this one for me at carm.org?  They will love this!

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BMZ
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 9:47am

To the Administrator,

Salaam Alaikum and I have miraculously lost my "editing power".  can you restore that please?

What is the use of blunt scissors?

Best Regards

BMZ

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Sawtul Khilafah
 
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bullet Posted: 18 October 2006 at 10:05am

Bismillahirrahmaanerraheem

I dont think I quited understand what you mean bzmsp.

 'Eesa (Jesus) is the Word of Allah. He was created by Allah's Word, Allah said "Be" and he was, meaning that he was born miraculously.

The Bible also calls him "the Word of God" in the book of revelation, chapter 19.

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