IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum: What are they so afraid of?

Author

Message

Sawtul Khilafah

Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 20 July 2006
Location: Peru
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 623

Posted: 25 September 2006 at 10:31pm

It's funny being called an "American" by someone who himself lives in the United States, and possibly pays taxes and helps the economy, thus helping the Government in the murder of Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan...!

In any case Angela's post gave the wrong impression (at least to me) because first she talked about western "morality" being brought to Afghanistan, then condemns those who oppose these things!

It's as if someone says: "Germany was bombed and defeated in World War 2 and thus democracy replaced the evil Nazi Government. Nazis were very evil people, they were racist and ..."

Now this sentence gives the impression that whoever says it does not only oppose the beliefs of Nazis, but also supports the bombing of Germany in World War 2. He or she may not SAY "I am happy they were bombed" but the sentence Does give that impression.

I got the exact same impression from the sentence posted by Angela which I quoted above. Again I apologise to Angela for being too harsh, but hope that she would also be more careful in the future.

IP Logged

Cassandra

Senior Member

Joined: 30 May 2006
Location: Spain
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 295

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 3:07am

Thank you Angela for you insightful and (to me) very clear comments.

But to the rest of you, I am still waiting for an answer to my question above: is there any "justification" for this killing of a courageous Muslim woman who despite vilification and ultimately the loss of her life sought education, respect, and a right to have some say over their lives and personal dignity for Afghan women?

To me the answer is "no", but then I am not Muslim. What I have read still tells me the answer should be "no", yet the perpetrators (presumably) did this with a clear conscience sure that what they were doing was somehow sanctioned.

Can anyone clarify this for me please?

IP Logged

Daniel Dworsky

Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 17 March 2005
Location: Israel
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 777

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 3:12am

Cassandra: This woman was a hero. This is clear enough to me.
Sawtul: (Doesn't that mean "Stoner") I think you are full of your own
metaphore. What's more I am tired of stepping in it.

Edited by Daniel Dworsky

IP Logged

Sawtul Khilafah

Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 20 July 2006
Location: Peru
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 623

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 4:05am

Originally posted by Cassandra

Thank you Angela for you insightful and (to me) very clear comments.

Ofcourse YOU would say that...youre the one who started this thread

Originally posted by Cassandra

If this was the case, then no there is no justification for it at all.

But beware of propaganda, especially coming from the drug addict Northern Alliance, and the WMD seeking US Government.

How could the Taliban Kill a woman for teaching, when they themselves wanted to build schools for girls and didnt only due to lack of funds?

How could the Taliban kill a woman when they believe killing women is not allowed except in the case of married adultery or murder.

Why would the Taliban even bother with this when they are busy enough fighting over 70,000 Northern Alliance troops, 11,000 Americans, and thousands and thousands of other troops including Nato?

IP Logged

Sawtul Khilafah

Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 20 July 2006
Location: Peru
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 623

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 4:08am

Originally posted by Daniel Dworsky

Sawtul: (Doesn't that mean "Stoner") I think you are full of your own
metaphore. What's more I am tired of stepping in it.

No it doesnt...

IP Logged

Daniel Dworsky

Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 17 March 2005
Location: Israel
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 777

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 4:50am

Pronounced sootul means one under the influence

IP Logged

Whisper
Male Other
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 25 July 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4752

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 6:22am

Its just great to have you back, Cassandra!

I watched a show once on Soviet Occupied Afghanistan. The Soviets encouraged the women to get out, and ditch the traditional garb. Women were wearing short skirts, western styles and going to bars. (Men, too) I think many of these men are afraid to see that kind of morality come back to Afghanistan. They are also afraid of losing control.

That could be one of the reasons in this strange and a bit confused scenario, but these days we are, mostly, getting a lot of retreat propaganda. Kabul and Brussels are following CIA scripts.

Would you believe it, I have actually seen some of such guidance manuals!!

IP Logged

aka2x2

Senior Member

Joined: 12 September 2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 398

Posted: 26 September 2006 at 7:08am

Cassandra

You ask a valid question. I do not believe anyone can justify killing of a woman because she wants to improve conditions for women.

However, I think you simplify the issue by the way you asked your question. Let’s not forget that she was an official in the Karzai government. This government is currently engaged in a civil war. I do not know where you stand on this war. Personally, I no longer know whose side is less wrong. But, I do know there have been horrendous atrocities perpetrated by both sides.

Also please consider the fact that there have been assassination attempts on all government officials in Afghanistan. Why was this one successful? Did she have less protection than her male colleagues? If so why? Was there an investigation of the security lapse? Was anyone held accountable for the security lapse?

Is this another endless, senseless, savage war that will continue for generations to come?

Respectfully

aka2x2

IP Logged

	Active Topics Memberlist Calendar Search Help
	Register Login Old Forum

Current Events
IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Politics : Current Events

Topic: What are they so afraid of?
	<< Prev Page of 12 Next >>

Author	Message
Sawtul Khilafah Senior Member Joined: 20 July 2006 Location: Peru Online Status: Offline Posts: 623	Posted: 25 September 2006 at 10:31pm
	It's funny being called an "American" by someone who himself lives in the United States, and possibly pays taxes and helps the economy, thus helping the Government in the murder of Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan...! In any case Angela's post gave the wrong impression (at least to me) because first she talked about western "morality" being brought to Afghanistan, then condemns those who oppose these things! It's as if someone says: "Germany was bombed and defeated in World War 2 and thus democracy replaced the evil Nazi Government. Nazis were very evil people, they were racist and ..." Now this sentence gives the impression that whoever says it does not only oppose the beliefs of Nazis, but also supports the bombing of Germany in World War 2. He or she may not SAY "I am happy they were bombed" but the sentence Does give that impression. I got the exact same impression from the sentence posted by Angela which I quoted above. Again I apologise to Angela for being too harsh, but hope that she would also be more careful in the future.
	IP Logged

Cassandra Senior Member Joined: 30 May 2006 Location: Spain Online Status: Offline Posts: 295	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 3:07am
	Thank you Angela for you insightful and (to me) very clear comments. But to the rest of you, I am still waiting for an answer to my question above: is there any "justification" for this killing of a courageous Muslim woman who despite vilification and ultimately the loss of her life sought education, respect, and a right to have some say over their lives and personal dignity for Afghan women? To me the answer is "no", but then I am not Muslim. What I have read still tells me the answer should be "no", yet the perpetrators (presumably) did this with a clear conscience sure that what they were doing was somehow sanctioned. Can anyone clarify this for me please?
	IP Logged

Daniel Dworsky Senior Member Joined: 17 March 2005 Location: Israel Online Status: Offline Posts: 777	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 3:12am
	Cassandra: This woman was a hero. This is clear enough to me. Sawtul: (Doesn't that mean "Stoner") I think you are full of your own metaphore. What's more I am tired of stepping in it. Edited by Daniel Dworsky
	IP Logged

Sawtul Khilafah Senior Member Joined: 20 July 2006 Location: Peru Online Status: Offline Posts: 623	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 4:05am
	*Originally posted by Cassandra* *Thank you Angela for you insightful and (to me) very clear comments.* Ofcourse YOU would say that...youre the one who started this thread *Originally posted by Cassandra* But to the rest of you, I am still waiting for an answer to my question above: is there any "justification" for this killing of a courageous Muslim woman who despite vilification and ultimately the loss of her life sought education, respect, and a right to have some say over their lives and personal dignity for Afghan women? If this was the case, then no there is no justification for it at all. But beware of propaganda, especially coming from the drug addict Northern Alliance, and the WMD seeking US Government. How could the Taliban Kill a woman for teaching, when they themselves wanted to build schools for girls and didnt only due to lack of funds? How could the Taliban kill a woman when they believe killing women is not allowed except in the case of married adultery or murder. Why would the Taliban even bother with this when they are busy enough fighting over 70,000 Northern Alliance troops, 11,000 Americans, and thousands and thousands of other troops including Nato?
	IP Logged

Sawtul Khilafah Senior Member Joined: 20 July 2006 Location: Peru Online Status: Offline Posts: 623	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 4:08am
	*Originally posted by Daniel Dworsky* Sawtul: (Doesn't that mean "Stoner") I think you are full of your own metaphore. What's more I am tired of stepping in it. No it doesnt...
	IP Logged

Daniel Dworsky Senior Member Joined: 17 March 2005 Location: Israel Online Status: Offline Posts: 777	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 4:50am
	Pronounced sootul means one under the influence
	IP Logged

Whisper Male Other Senior Member Joined: 25 July 2004 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 4752	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 6:22am
	Its just great to have you back, Cassandra! I watched a show once on Soviet Occupied Afghanistan. The Soviets encouraged the women to get out, and ditch the traditional garb. Women were wearing short skirts, western styles and going to bars. (Men, too) I think many of these men are afraid to see that kind of morality come back to Afghanistan. They are also afraid of losing control. That could be one of the reasons in this strange and a bit confused scenario, but these days we are, mostly, getting a lot of retreat propaganda. Kabul and Brussels are following CIA scripts. Would you believe it, I have actually seen some of such guidance manuals!!
	IP Logged

aka2x2 Senior Member Joined: 12 September 2006 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 398	Posted: 26 September 2006 at 7:08am
	Cassandra You ask a valid question. I do not believe anyone can justify killing of a woman because she wants to improve conditions for women. However, I think you simplify the issue by the way you asked your question. Let’s not forget that she was an official in the Karzai government. This government is currently engaged in a civil war. I do not know where you stand on this war. Personally, I no longer know whose side is less wrong. But, I do know there have been horrendous atrocities perpetrated by both sides. Also please consider the fact that there have been assassination attempts on all government officials in Afghanistan. Why was this one successful? Did she have less protection than her male colleagues? If so why? Was there an investigation of the security lapse? Was anyone held accountable for the security lapse? Is this another endless, senseless, savage war that will continue for generations to come?
	Respectfully aka2x2
	IP Logged