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Interfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Interfaith Dialogue
Message Icon Topic: 1 Timothy 2 and the "silent" women Post Reply Post New Topic
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DavidC
 
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Quote DavidC Replybullet Posted: 04 June 2006 at 6:39am
The subservience of women was universal throughout the early church.  That is a historical fact.  It is reflected in scripture, but when you read the first bishops of the church it is spelled out very clearly.

As to procreation, that was not considered important or even desirable.  The early Christians were trying to avoid the world, not be more involved with it.

Pick up a history of the early church sometime.  You will be quite surprised at how different early Christianity was from our current belief system.
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Patty
 
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Quote Patty Replybullet Posted: 04 June 2006 at 11:32am

Dear Annie,

You said the following:

"I think that Jesus showed that men and women were equal.  He had a lot of women followers and many became leaders in the very early church.  So since women were allowed to become leaders there must have been some concensus among Jesus' Apostles that this would be acceptable to Jesus."

Of course Jesus held women and men as equals.  He loved women, and some of his closest and dearest followers were women.  There was, however, no concensus that women were to be priests.  (Just as men cannot ever give birth.) The priesthood is reserved only for men, because Christ in his human form was a man.  Further, the original 12 disciples went on to follow in the Tradition of Christ and chose all male bishops after them.

"Weren't there women leaders in the Old Testament?"

There were highly regarded women in the Old Testament for sure, but we're talking New Testament here....when Jesus established His Church here on earth.

"Do you think there will come a time that women will be allowed to be priests in the Catholic church.  My Catholic friends think so."

No, I don't believe that will happen.  It is a very anti-Catholic desire by some Catholics....they are considered dissidents, or protestors.  They usually belong to dissident groups who would like to "change the Church", such as Voice of the Faithful, CORPUS, Call to Action, etc.  They are not recognized by Rome, and are getting pretty close to being out of communion with the Vatican.  Some have already been excommunicated as their proposed changes are nothing more than heresy.  I do believe that one day Roman Catholic priests will not be required to take vows of celibacy and will be given the option of marrying.  Right now the Church still believes a celibate priest is more able to focus entirely on his "flock", his parishioners.  If he were married, his focus would be divided between his flock and his wife and children.  That distraction is not what the Church wants at this time.

As I have always said, as long as we follow what our conscience tells us is correct, love God above all else, and love our neighbors as ourselfves, It seems to me that God will take this all into consideration on Judgement Day.  But the Catholic Church will not fall, because Jesus said it would not when he first established it.  So if there are individuals who, after great studying and prayer, find they can no longer can accept the teachings of the Holy Catholic Church, my own personal opinion is they should find a church with which they do agree (always remembering they are more than welcome to return at any time.)  Catholics are returning in droves to the Church.  Many left during the 70's, and are now coming back to their Catholic roots.  Also during this year's Easter Vigil, over 200,000 converts were received into the Church in the US alone.

God Bless You Always, Annie!

 

Patty

I don't know what the future holds....but I know who holds the future.
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Patty
 
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Quote Patty Replybullet Posted: 04 June 2006 at 11:42am

Annie also stated,

"Sex only for procreation is another subject.  Does this mean that once the wife becomes pregnant that all sex should stop?  Desire stops?  God did not make humans that way.  That in itself should tell us that God intended the pleasure of sex to be more than just for procreation."

Sex was also to bond the husband and wife and refers to marriage as becoming "one flesh".  We are to be "open" to conception.  If God wants the woman to become pregant and she does, great!  If not, it isn't meant to be at that time. 

Annie, if you're really interested in learning what the Church truly teaches and believes, don't rely on friends trying to tell you.  You need a scholar.  One of the best things you can do to inform yourself properly is read the Catechism of the Catholic Church....or at least look up parts on which you have questions.  (I'm not trying to convert you, just offer some suggestions for help.)  I hate to see twisted lies, myths, etc., which are spread far too often about the Church.  It is much better to read it from the Vatican website, than to listen to the biased, horribly uninformed, media....or friends who don't really know Church history or doctrine.  It's very important to know the truth.

Peace and Blessings, Annie.

Patty

I don't know what the future holds....but I know who holds the future.
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