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 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : General : Comments & Complaints
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Athanasius
 
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 9:18am
Angela, I don't care whether or not you agree with Christianity or Methodism, in particular, however don't misrepresent the official doctrine of that church. 
Freedom is a gift from God - to deny men freedom is to worship evil.
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Angela
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 9:50am

And you have me at a disadvantage for proving my statement.  Since I no longer have access to the very book in question.  So, end of discussion. 

Anyone who wants to know the Doctrines of the United Methodist Church may go to their offical website.

http://www.umc.org  They do not have to take my word for it.  I, however, only can draw from what I read and what I was taught.

I should mention, that at the age of 15 I asked my minister to give me the confirmation classes.  He was leaving and asked me to wait for the new minister.  I agreed for Paster Crushank (a very wonderful man now with God) and Paster Cutchall came into the parsonage.  He refused me, saying at 16, I didn't need the classes, he'd just confirm me.  Later, he was found to have taken over $25,000 from the Church, had a stack of empty JD bottles in the parsonage after the Church kicked him out and later accusations from a number of the kids in the neighborhood started to surface.  He's dead now of a heroine overdose.  So, if I don't understand the Methodist Doctrine, its the fault of the ministry of the church. 

Anyone needed to learn can go the UMC website.  Just as I tell anyone if they want to know about my church they need to go to our official site.

 

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Athanasius
 
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 10:01am

Angela, I am really disgusted that you would make this accusation against a Methodist minister and then post it on a Muslim site - what for?  Your story does nothing but defame Methodist.  Why this vindictivness? Are you attempting to give the impression to Muslims here that Christian pastors cannot be trusted?  What is your motive?

People who live in glass houses, Angela, shouldn't throw stone:

http://lds-mormon.com/benson.shtml 

http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/stories.pl?ACCT=104&ST ORY=/www/story/09-05-2001/0001566613&EDATE

 

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Angela
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 10:24am

What you think the Catholics are the only ones who have people in power overstep there bounds?  Did you know Rosanne Barr was molested by her Mormon Bishop or that he knew about her molestation?  It happens in every Church. My point was the UMC is not squeaky clean. 

Pastor Charles Cutchall....Pennsylvania.  Go ahead and check it out.  He was cast out of the Methodist Church.  You should be able to find and obituary for him but its a small town of about 3000 people, there is no local paper. 

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Athanasius
 
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 10:32am

Actually, I have lived in Pennsylvania.  Should be hard for me to have one of my workers track it down.  However, the point I've made here is that you have gone out of your way to defame a whole denomination based on your so-called experience.  You have provided no definitive proof that anything Methodists teach is anywhere close to saying that the unbaptized with burn in hell (which is a Roman Catholic teaching, not Methodist). Second, you bring accusations against a dead man (possibly true) who may or may not have been involved in very un-Christianlike character, and portray this as one of the reasons you embraced Mormonism and left Christianity.

Well, if those two reasons were valid for you - then you must examine the fact that Mormonism teaches that baptism is necessary for salvation (which is why they perform vicarious baptisms in their temples), and also that Mormonism has just as much stuff going on in that sect that is immoral and contrary to Christ, as any other organization.

In other words, as I said before, don't throw rocks in glass houses. 

 

Freedom is a gift from God - to deny men freedom is to worship evil.
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Angela
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 10:46am

And you shouldn't automatically assume I'm lying.  You don't know if I'm one of his victims.  (I'm not but I personally know one.)  Someone wanted to know WHY, I told them.  I have a right to put forth my experiences because they are my reasons.  I do not make false accusations.  I speak from first hand experience.

I posted the UMC website.  If anyone wants to know about your Church, they can go there, they don't have to take my word for it.

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Athanasius
 
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 11:02am
Angela, you need to forgive this man and get on with your life.  Don't spend the rest of your life posting this experience on the Internet.  And by the way, the UMC is no longer my church - it's far too liberal for me.
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John Brown
 
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bullet Posted: 13 April 2006 at 11:53am

Angela:  I too was raised as a Methodist, although I spent a lot of time at the Russian Orthodox church where my dad's family attended.  However, I officially attended the Methodist church, was baptised and confirmed there.  Sorry, but I remember nothing in their teaching about babies going to hell.  They do teach about original sin but you can open up the scriptures in the holy bible to get that information. We are born with a sin nature.  Do you have children?  Anyone with a toddler should have no problem with the doctrine of original sin.  Children have to be taught to be good, how to behave and the appropriate behavior in a civilized society.  They also are taught how to be Christians or muslims, or mormons, aren't they?  Further, the bible and the methodist church also, teach about the age of reason.  Angela, the jews also believe this as well.  in other words, a child under the age of reason (puberty) is not held accountable for his/her actions.  In any event, I am somewhat disturbed by your attitude and your refusal to cite the language in the UMC hymnal you claim makes these statements to which you refer.    It seems to me that your hostility stems from the fact that people disagree with you and ask you to prove an assertion that you have thus far not been able to substantiate more than the fact that someone called you a name.

Finally, where do you worship?  What exactly are your core beliefs?  You have yet to answer that question.

John Brown

 PS i agree with athanasious that it is wrong to take shots at a Christian minister-particularly on a muslim site- and who is not able to defend himself.  besides blaming him is an excuse.  He is a man, not the church. Men will always fail--oh--that's right--ORIGINAL SIN!

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