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Rehmat

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Joined: 28 February 2005
Location: Canada
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Posts: 474

Posted: 15 April 2005 at 4:30pm

Originally posted by AhmadJoyia

.... Knowledge without wisdom is useless; and in that sense, use your knowledge wisely. With your argumentive based knowlegde you may win over a debate but may not the "hearts". Think what is more important and decide for your own self. May Allah bless us all. Amen....

Let me introduce you to the 'Reality Channel - Knowledge is for the seeker - but wisdom is a God-given gift - Since you pretend to got both of them - Let me the first one to congratulate you.

As for your 'vision' of 'Terrorists, innocent Israelis, and the good Jews' - let some practicing Jew bring you out of your great perspective of Palestinian situation - No other than some Rabbis.

http://www.nkusa.org/index.cfm

And once you finish listening to them - do yourself a favour by not believing everything CNN or Saudis propagandist tell you.

Know your enemy!
No time to waste. Act now!
Tomorrow it will be too late
What You Don’t Know Can Kill You

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Shams Zaman
Male Islam
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Joined: 20 March 2005
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Posts: 135

Posted: 16 April 2005 at 2:19pm

Dear Ahmed Joya

Sorry for the late reply. Well dear we all use different logics and different assumptions for various things. Christians have thier own, Muslima their own and Jews have their own. Its not always that your logic matches with the other. Similarly we may share the same religion but use different logic. For me the Shbbahas(RA) are equally authentic but a degree lesser to the Prophet's Hadiths. The Haduth did not came from the Angel Gabrail but from the Sahabbah so if you do not consider their quote as authentic perhaps the Hadith will also become un-authentic. Similarly if some scientific fact goes against your faith or logic you certainly will refute it. I disagree with the Darwin theory regardless of the point whether science consider it to be worthwile or not. Regarding the question of whether we are heading towards the end of this world or net or not you can just type Signs of Dooms day in your search engine and you will see what the Holy Prophet has fortold us in this regard. I am sure you will reach the right conclusion. Give me some time and I will translate it on a document to send it to you (Insha Allah). If I lived till that time.

Shams Zaman Pakistan ; smszmn72@yahoo.com

smszmn72@yahoo.cm

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AhmadJoyia

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Joined: 20 March 2005
Location: Pakistan
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Posts: 1161

Posted: 17 April 2005 at 1:28pm

Originally posted by Rehmat

Let me introduce you to the 'Reality Channel - Knowledge is for the seeker - but wisdom is a God-given gift - Since you pretend to got both of them - Let me the first one to congratulate you.

No, thanks! let me remain fool and unwise (atleast a door open to improve upon myself).

Originally posted by Rehmat

As for your 'vision' of 'Terrorists, innocent Israelis, and the good Jews' - let some practicing Jew bring you out of your great perspective of Palestinian situation - No other than some Rabbis.

http://www.nkusa.org/index.cfm

Your link seems to support my stance more than ever. Think, if any of these Rabbis happen to converse with you on this forum, how would you deal with him?

Originally posted by Rehmat

And once you finish listening to them - do yourself a favour by not believing everything CNN or Saudis propagandist tell you.

Got it. But, I think I am already under the debt of your knowledge about them.

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AhmadJoyia

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Joined: 20 March 2005
Location: Pakistan
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Posts: 1161

Posted: 17 April 2005 at 1:50pm

Originally posted by Shams Zaman

Dear Ahmed Joya

Shams Zaman Pakistan ; ; smszmn72@yahoo.com

Kindly let me know if I am wrong in any of my observations about your article. I have raised specific objections in your references on which you based your conclusion and would like to know your specific responses on them.

This is exactly what I meant from my comments that you also seem to agree with me but with different wording. Your quote "For me the Shbbahas(RA) are equally authentic but a degree lesser to the Prophet's Hadiths." However, I also gave the reason for this that Sahaba didn't claim to have the divine revelations that they could relate matters concerning to the creation of adam or "who ruled earth before adam". This kind of knowledge is exclusively from prophet Mohammad or Quran. There is nothing deregoratory about Sahaba in it. So unless it is a hadith of Prophet Mohammad that any Sahaba is referencing from, though I would not dare to say that the Sahaba is wrong, but to say that the hadith might be "weak". Hope this would clear up any misconceptions about me, if you had any. Hope to hear more constructive reply on my previous questions than invoking new ones. May Allah help us all. Regards

Your brother.

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Rehmat

Guest Group

Joined: 28 February 2005
Location: Canada
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 474

Posted: 17 April 2005 at 2:57pm

Originally posted by AhmadJoyia

...No, thanks! let me remain fool and unwise (atleast a door open to improve upon myself).

There is no copulsion in religion - at least in Islam.

Know your enemy!
No time to waste. Act now!
Tomorrow it will be too late
What You Don’t Know Can Kill You

IP Logged

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Author	Message
Rehmat Guest Group Joined: 28 February 2005 Location: Canada Online Status: Offline Posts: 474	Posted: 15 April 2005 at 4:30pm
	*Originally posted by AhmadJoyia* .... Knowledge without wisdom is useless; and in that sense, use your knowledge wisely. With your argumentive based knowlegde you may win over a debate but may not the "hearts". Think what is more important and decide for your own self. May Allah bless us all. Amen.... Let me introduce you to the 'Reality Channel - Knowledge is for the seeker - but wisdom is a God-given gift - Since you pretend to got both of them - Let me the first one to congratulate you. As for your 'vision' of 'Terrorists, innocent Israelis, and the good Jews' - let some practicing Jew bring you out of your great perspective of Palestinian situation - No other than some Rabbis. http://www.nkusa.org/index.cfm And once you finish listening to them - do yourself a favour by not believing everything CNN or Saudis propagandist tell you.
	Know your enemy! No time to waste. Act now! Tomorrow it will be too late What You Don’t Know Can Kill You
	IP Logged

Shams Zaman Male Islam Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 135	Posted: 16 April 2005 at 2:19pm
	Dear Ahmed Joya Sorry for the late reply. Well dear we all use different logics and different assumptions for various things. Christians have thier own, Muslima their own and Jews have their own. Its not always that your logic matches with the other. Similarly we may share the same religion but use different logic. For me the Shbbahas(RA) are equally authentic but a degree lesser to the Prophet's Hadiths. The Haduth did not came from the Angel Gabrail but from the Sahabbah so if you do not consider their quote as authentic perhaps the Hadith will also become un-authentic. Similarly if some scientific fact goes against your faith or logic you certainly will refute it. I disagree with the Darwin theory regardless of the point whether science consider it to be worthwile or not. Regarding the question of whether we are heading towards the end of this world or net or not you can just type Signs of Dooms day in your search engine and you will see what the Holy Prophet has fortold us in this regard. I am sure you will reach the right conclusion. Give me some time and I will translate it on a document to send it to you (Insha Allah). If I lived till that time. Shams Zaman Pakistan ; smszmn72@yahoo.com
	smszmn72@yahoo.cm
	IP Logged

AhmadJoyia Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Location: Pakistan Online Status: Offline Posts: 1161	Posted: 17 April 2005 at 1:28pm
	*Originally posted by Rehmat* Let me introduce you to the 'Reality Channel - Knowledge is for the seeker - but wisdom is a God-given gift - Since you pretend to got both of them - Let me the first one to congratulate you. No, thanks! let me remain fool and unwise (atleast a door open to improve upon myself). *Originally posted by Rehmat* As for your 'vision' of 'Terrorists, innocent Israelis, and the good Jews' - let some practicing Jew bring you out of your great perspective of Palestinian situation - No other than some Rabbis. http://www.nkusa.org/index.cfm Your link seems to support my stance more than ever. Think, if any of these Rabbis happen to converse with you on this forum, how would you deal with him? *Originally posted by Rehmat* And once you finish listening to them - do yourself a favour by not believing everything CNN or Saudis propagandist tell you. Got it. But, I think I am already under the debt of your knowledge about them.
	IP Logged

AhmadJoyia Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Location: Pakistan Online Status: Offline Posts: 1161	Posted: 17 April 2005 at 1:50pm
	*Originally posted by Shams Zaman* Dear Ahmed Joya Sorry for the late reply. Well dear we all use different logics and different assumptions for various things. Christians have thier own, Muslima their own and Jews have their own. Its not always that your logic matches with the other. Similarly we may share the same religion but use different logic. For me the Shbbahas(RA) are equally authentic but a degree lesser to the Prophet's Hadiths. The Haduth did not came from the Angel Gabrail but from the Sahabbah so if you do not consider their quote as authentic perhaps the Hadith will also become un-authentic. Similarly if some scientific fact goes against your faith or logic you certainly will refute it. I disagree with the Darwin theory regardless of the point whether science consider it to be worthwile or not. Regarding the question of whether we are heading towards the end of this world or net or not you can just type Signs of Dooms day in your search engine and you will see what the Holy Prophet has fortold us in this regard. I am sure you will reach the right conclusion. Give me some time and I will translate it on a document to send it to you (Insha Allah). If I lived till that time. Shams Zaman Pakistan ; ; smszmn72@yahoo.com Kindly let me know if I am wrong in any of my observations about your article. I have raised specific objections in your references on which you based your conclusion and would like to know your specific responses on them. This is exactly what I meant from my comments that you also seem to agree with me but with different wording. Your quote "For me the Shbbahas(RA) are equally authentic *but a degree lesser* to the Prophet's Hadiths." However, I also gave the reason for this that Sahaba didn't claim to have the divine revelations that they could relate matters concerning to the creation of adam or "who ruled earth before adam". This kind of knowledge is exclusively from prophet Mohammad or Quran. There is nothing deregoratory about Sahaba in it. So unless it is a hadith of Prophet Mohammad that any Sahaba is referencing from, though I would not dare to say that the Sahaba is wrong, but to say that the hadith might be "weak". Hope this would clear up any misconceptions about me, if you had any. Hope to hear more constructive reply on my previous questions than invoking new ones. May Allah help us all. Regards Your brother.
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Rehmat Guest Group Joined: 28 February 2005 Location: Canada Online Status: Offline Posts: 474	Posted: 17 April 2005 at 2:57pm
	*Originally posted by AhmadJoyia* ...No, thanks! let me remain fool and unwise (atleast a door open to improve upon myself). There is no copulsion in religion - at least in Islam.
	Know your enemy! No time to waste. Act now! Tomorrow it will be too late What You Don’t Know Can Kill You
	IP Logged

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