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Islamic INTRAfaith Dialogue
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AhmadJoyia
 
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Quote AhmadJoyia Replybullet Posted: 10 November 2005 at 7:17am

Originally posted by Fateh-Momin

Let me continue on the event of Seige of Constantinople, before I answer the post by AhmadJoyia as he use to making statement which he regrets in the end.

Thanks bro for your concern for me, though not without malice, that too, by completely ignoring to respond to my other questions as well. Ok, coming back to the topic, it is interesting to note that you provided two names for the Byzantine emperor, i.e when you say "In the year 48 Hijrah when the Byzantine emperor Constantine was murdered, it was Mu'awiyah's turn to take advantage of the situation." in one of the narrations and another when you say "Al-Bukhari gave a long narration of the contents of the letter sent by the Prophet to Hercules, king of the Byzantines". In this view, can you provide any explanation as which emperor and / or city was being referred by Rasullalah in your quoted hadith?

Secondly, if we critically look at the situation that you are trying to portray, it seems like that on one end Prophet was sending dawah messages through peace missions and on the other side he was instigating Muslims to invade the Christian capital without providing any reason to it. How these two apperantly  mismatch strategies can be reconciled, keeping in view the verses of Quran for the Christians as you also quoted from the Shahi Bokhari? I shall reinstate them here for completion purposes.

"Say (O Muhammad ): ‘O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allâh, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allâh.’ Then, if they turn away, say: ‘Bear witness that we are Muslims.’ " [3:64] 

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Fatah-Momin
 
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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 10 November 2005 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by AhmadJoyia

 

Thanks bro for your concern for me, though not without malice, that too, by completely ignoring to respond to my other questions as well. Ok, coming back to the topic, it is interesting to note that you provided two names for the Byzantine emperor, i.e when you say "In the year 48 Hijrah when the Byzantine emperor Constantine was murdered, it was Mu'awiyah's turn to take advantage of the situation." in one of the narrations and another when you say "Al-Bukhari gave a long narration of the contents of the letter sent by the Prophet to Hercules, king of the Byzantines". In this view, can you provide any explanation as which emperor and / or city was being referred by Rasullalah in your quoted hadith?

Secondly, if we critically look at the situation that you are trying to portray, it seems like that on one end Prophet was sending dawah messages through peace missions and on the other side he was instigating Muslims to invade the Christian capital without providing any reason to it. How these two apperantly  mismatch strategies can be reconciled, keeping in view the verses of Quran for the Christians as you also quoted from the Shahi Bokhari? I shall reinstate them here for completion purposes.

"Say (O Muhammad ): ‘O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allâh, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allâh.’ Then, if they turn away, say: ‘Bear witness that we are Muslims.’ " [3:64] 

See how craftly you mix two posts togather, the post I continued the siege of constantinople is different from the one where I quote from Book about the life of the Blessed prophet. Hercules was the king during the life time of Nabi Allah[saw] and the siege happened in 48 Hijrah right after the Constantine passsed away. Why do you not do the math at home before you post any responses. Please also learn difference between Dawah and Invasion.

 

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Quote AhmadJoyia Replybullet Posted: 11 November 2005 at 7:31am

Originally posted by Fatah-Momin

See how craftly you mix ,....

Thanks bro again for being typical. Your persistant abuses on my intentions are now coming to the understanding of everyone on this forum more than any where else.

... two posts togather the post I continued the siege of constantinople is different from the one where I quote from Book about the life of the Blessed prophet. Hercules was the king during the life time of Nabi Allah[saw] and the siege happened in 48 Hijrah right after the Constantine passsed away. Why do you not do the math at home before you post any responses. Please also learn difference between Dawah and Invasion.

Humbly stated, your reply is far away from the logical reasoning I have presented. Kindly see if one needs tutoring to understand "logic". Obviously, this forum is not the right place for such an activity. Nevertheless, it is exactly this math that provides total refutation of your understanding of the hadith that you quoted for invasion. In fact, its not me who is joining the two occassions, but you yourself when you said in one of your earliest posts "This was the first campaign by the Muslims to occupy Constantinople. The Prophet[saw] had given the good tiding of paradise who took part in the campaign." Hopefully, now you may realise the point I have highlighted. Hope to hear logical reasoning than emotional from you. May Allah bless us all.

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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 11 November 2005 at 10:11am
I think bro either you do not want to understand the issue or you have an hidden agenda in both the cases it is intentional. This is why I requested you to have a open debate with me on the issue of your choice, let us debate this very issue,what is your stand on Yazid Bin Mu'awiyah. We will begin from here.
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Quote AhmadJoyia Replybullet Posted: 11 November 2005 at 12:56pm

Originally posted by Fatah-Momin

I think bro either you do not want to understand the issue or you have an hidden agenda in both the cases it is intentional.

Your thinking is not logical, though I am very sorry to say this, my brother. I have neigther any "hidden agenda" nor it is true that I don't want to understand the issue. Rather, I shall appreciate that there is some one who is bringing the other side of the story as well, which is new to me at least. However, one must proceed with caution with all the logical analysis of the material to sift right from the wrong. It is in this context that all my questions are from your own material that you have posted uptill now, not from "bad" but sincere intentions to understand them in their right perspective. Since its you who is providing this info, therefore, its understanding is assumed to be with you. But if you are simply cutting and pasting from the book that you referred, though the efforts are still commendable, but understanding of the issue becomes even more important. It is in this regard that my questions become even more important to look at. 

In the end, I don't have any opinions about early personalities of Islam except that they all were humans.

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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 11 November 2005 at 10:24pm

You say "proceed with caution" and when I do you say  "conclusion that fears me alot from too precautionary a note" Make up your mind, which route you want to take.



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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2005 at 8:29pm
DISASTER OF CAMEL 

Some people relate that when the pledge of allegiance to `Ali was completed, Talha and az-Zubayr asked `Ali for permission to go to Makka. (135) `Ali said, "Perhaps you mean to go to Basra and Syria?" They swore that they would not do that. (136) `A'isha was at Makka. (137) `Abdullah b. `Amr, the Governor of `Uthman over Basra and Ya'la b. Umayya, `Uthman's Governor over the Yemen, fled to Makka.

All of them met in Makka. They included Marwan b. al-Hakam. The Banu Umayya met and they wanted revenge for `Uthman's blood. Ya`la gave Talha, az-Zubayr, and `A'isha four hundred dirhams. He gave two hundred dinars. They wanted to go to Syria. Ibn `Amir stopped them and said, "You have not agreed to meet Mu`awiya. I have hirelings in Basra. Go to them instead."

They came to Ma'al-Hawa'ib (138) and the dogs barked. `A'isha asked and was told, "This is the water of al-Hawa'ib." She took his halter from him. That was because she had heard the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, say, "Which of you will be the one with the thick- haired camel (139) when the dogs bark at her at al-Huwa'ib?" Talha and az-Zubayr testified that that was not Ma'al-Hawa'ib and fifty men added to them. (140) It was the first false testimony which had occurred in Islam. (141)

`Ali went to Kufa. (142) `Ali travelled from Madina to Iraq by way of ar-Rabadha, Fid, ath-Tha'labiya, al-Asawid and Dhu Qar. From ar-Rabadha, he sent Muhammad b. Abi Bakr and Muhammad b. Ja`far to Kufa. They came back to him while he was at Dhu Qar, saying that Abu Musa and the people of discernment among the Kufans wanted to refrain and not to go out. He sent al-Ashtar and Ibn `Abbas. Then he sent his son al-Hasan and `Ammar to win the people over to him. While he was on his way, `Uthman b. Hanif and Hukaym b. Jabala started to fight the People of the Camel. In al-Asawid, he received news of the death of Hukaym b. Jabala and the murderers of `Uthman. Then `Uthman b. Hanif came to `Ali while he was in ath-Tha'labiyya. `Uthman had his beard plucked out and he was helpless. `Ali set up his army in Dhu Qar. Then he went to Basra with his men, where the People of the Camel were located.

The two groups formed armies and met. (143) When `Ammar was near the howdah of `A'isha, he said, "What are you seeking?" They said, "We are seeking (revenge) for `Uthman's blood." He said, "On this day, Allah will kill the attackers and the one who seeks blood without a right." (144)
`Ali and az-Zubayr met. `Ali said to him, "Do you remember the words of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, that you would fight me?" az-Zubayr left him and went back. His son tried to make him return and he would not do it. Al-Ahnaf followed him (az-Zubayr) and then murdered him.(145)

`Ali called to Talha from a distance and said, "What do you want?" He said, "Revenge for `Uthman's blood." He said, "May Allah fight you! We are entrusted with the blood of `Uthman. Have you not heard the words of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, when he said, `Be a friend to the one who is his friend and be an enemy to the one who is his enemy and help the one who helps him and disappoint the one who disappoints him' You are the first to offer me allegiance and then break it." (146)

PROTECTION

As for their going to Basra, that is correct without any doubt.

But why did they go? There is no sound transmission regarding that and there is no one who is to be trusted in it because the reliable individuals did not tansmit anything. One does not listen to the words of the partisan, including the partisan who wants to attack Islam and find fault with the Companions.

It is possible that they went out to depose `Ali by something that seemed correct to them. (147) That was because they had offered homage to him in order to still the rebellion, but they still sought the truth.

It is possible that they went out to get power over `Uthman's murderers. (148)

It is possible that they went to join the groups of the muslims and to bring them together and refer them to the same law so that they would not be agitated and fight.

This is what is sound and nothing else. The sound reports bring that.

As for the first possibilities, they are all false and weak. As for their giving homage by force, that is false as we have clarified.

As for their seeking to depose him, that is false, because deposing a person is only by a universal opinion, although it is possible that one or two many appoint. Deposing someone only occurs after evidence and clarification.

As for their going out because of the business of the murderers of `Uthman, that is weak because the root before it was unity. It is possible to combine both matters. (149)

It is related that part of the rabble among the people had made them absent. (150)

Talha, az-Zubayr and `A'isha, the Umm al-Mu'minun, may Allah be pleased with them, left hoping to return people to their source and to preserve the respect of their Prophet. As evidence againt her, (151) they quoted Allah ta'ala when he said, "There is no good in much of their conspiring secretly except for the one who commands sadaqa or something correct or to put things right between people (4:114)." The Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, went out to make peace and he sent messenger for it. She hoped for the reward and used that story. She went out so that things would reach their proper conclusions.



================================================

135. `Abdullah b. `Umar b. al-Khattab was one of those who asked him for permission to go to Makka. The reason for that was that when the oath of homage to `Ali was finished, `Ali decided to fight the people of Syria. He delegated the people of Madina to go with him. He said, "I am a man of the people of Madina. If they go, I will go with them in full obedience. But I will not go out to fight this year." Then Ibn `Umar made provisions and left for Makka (Ibn Kathir, 7:230). Al-Hasan b. `Ali opposed his father about going out to fight the peope of Syria. `Ali left him in Madina as you will see later.

136. The words of `Ali to them, and their path to them, are part of what the perpetrators of the disaster and their transmitters added.

137. She and the Mothers of the Believers went to Makka when the attackers prevented water from reaching the Amir al-Mu'minin, `Uthman. He began to ask people for water. Umm Habiba brought water to him and they treated her with contempt. They struck the face of her mule and cut the rope of the mule with the sword (at -Tabari, 5:127). The Ummahat al-Mu'minin prepared to go on Hajj, to flee from the siege (Ibn Kathir, 7:229).

138. Al-Hawa'ib is one of the springs on the road to Basra. Abu'l-Fath Nasr b. `Abdu'r-Rahman al-Iskandari said that Yaqut quoted him in `The Collection of the Lands'. Abu `Ubayd al-Bakri said in his collection that it is some water near Basra on the Makkan road. It was named al-Hawa'ub bint Kalb b. Wabara al- Quda'iyya.

139. "Adib.": adabb. There is assimilation for the sake of the rhyme.Al-Adabb means much hair on the face, Ibn al-Athir said that in `The End'.

140. They did not testify and `A'isha did not say that nor did the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, say that. We will make that clear in its place in the Protection.

141. The false testimony came from rabble who did not fear Allah, like Abu Zaynab and Abu'l-Mawra' as was already stated. It came from those who claimed to have the power to create a personality which Allah did not create - like whoever fabricated the name of Thabit, the client of Umm Salama, as was already stated. As for Talha and az-Zubayr, they had been promised the Garden by the Prophet of mercy, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, who did not speak from passion. They had the highest character and they were notable to themselves and to Allah to give false testimony. This lie against them came from men who hated the Companions of the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace. It is not the first lie they made in Islam nor was it the last of the lies that they forged against him and his people.

142. He left Madina at the end of the month of Rabi' al-Akhir in 36 A.H. in order to be near to Syria. His son al-Hasan wanted his father to stay in Madina and take it as the abode of the khalifate as the three Khalifs had done before him (at-Tabari, 5:171). Look at 5:163

143. After `Ali reached Dhu Qarr, al-Qa'qa' b. `Amr understood to attempt to reach an agreement, `Ali went to Basra with his men. The murderers of `Uthman were quick to scotch the attempts at peace by starting the battle.

144. The two groups were seeking an understanding and unity. As for the attackers, they were the murderers of `Uthman. Allah killed them all except for one. That will be made clear.

145. Az-Zubayr's murderers were `Umayr b. Jurmuz, Faddala b. Habis and Nufay' at-Tamimi. Al-Ahnaf had too much fear of Allah to command them to kill him. He did hear them grumbling about the muslims fighting each other. Then they caught up to az-Zubayr and murdered him (at-Tabari, 5:197).

146. Talha was too true in belief and high in character to give allegiance and then break it. He wanted to unify things by investigating the murderers of `Uthman. `Ali agreed to this as will come in the following study. However, those who had committed a crime against Islam the first time when they attacked `Uthman were the enemies of Allah the next time by starting the fight between these two groups of muslims.

147. This possibility is remote in respect of those right-acting excellent ones. Nothing they did indicated this. All the events indicate that they were above it. This is what Ibn Hajar believed in `The Opening of the Creator' (13:41-42). In the book, `The Reports of Basra' by `Umar b. Shabba he quotes what al-Muhallab said, "No one transmitted that `A'isha and those with her debated `Ali out of desire for the Khalifate nor did any of them ask to be appointed Khalif."

148. This is what they used to say. However, they meant that they would reach an agreement with `Ali in any manner by which they could do that. This is what the Striving Companion al-Qa'qa' b. `Amr attempted to do. Both parties accepted him as will be mentioned.

149. The combination of the two matters very nearly took place if it had not been that the Saba'ites foiled it. The People of the Camel came about `Uthman's murderers. That was all that they sought. However, they wanted to reach an understanding about it with `Ali because reaching an understanding with him was the first way to obtain their goal.

150. i.e. Talha and az-Zubayr and `A'ishah were absent from Madina.

151. When they induced her to go to Basra


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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2005 at 8:30pm
The people of Basra became aware of them and those who had conspired against `Uthman egged the people on and said, "Go out to them so that you can see what they have come to do." `Uthman b. Hanif sent Hukaym b. Jabala. (152) He met Talha and az-Zubayr at az-Zabuqa, and Hukaym was killed. (153) If he had gone out as submitting muslim and not as a resistor, (154) nothing would have happened to him. What good did he have in defence? What was he defending? They did not come as fighters or rulers. They were working for peace and desired to bring things together. Whoever went out to them and opposed them and fought them, opposed their goal as is done in all journeys and goals.

When they reached Basra, the people met them in a group (155) at the upper part of Al-Murbadd. There were so many of them that if a stone had been thrown, it would have fallen on a man's head. Talha spoke, az-Zubayr spoke, and `A'isha spoke, may Allah be pleased with all of them. (156) There was a great uproar. (157) Talha said, "Be quiet," They began to pester him and would not be silent. He said, "Shame, shame. A bed of fire and flies of ambition!" Then turned back without having clarified things. (158) They went down to the Banu Nahd, and people threw stone at them until they had descended the mountain. (159)

Talha, az-Zubayr and `Uthman b. Hanif, the Governor of `Ali over Basra, met. They agreed in writing between them not to fight, that `Uthman had the House of the Amirate, the Mosque, and the Treasury and that Talha and az-Zubayr could stay wherever they wished in Basra and the two parties would not turn against each other until `Ali had come. `Ali came to Basra (160) and they drew near so as to see each other. (161) The people of the sects did not leave them alone. They hastened to shed blood and the war started. There was clamour in the mob. All of that was done so that there would not be a clear proof and the state would not be clarified and the murderers of `Uthman could remain hidden. If one man in the army can pervert its direction, then how is it when there are a thousand perverting it?

It is related that when Marwan saw Talha in the ranks, he said, "We do not seek for traces after finding the sources." and that he shot his arrow and killed him. (162) It was related that he was hit by an arrow at the command of Marwan, not that Marwan himself shot it. (163)

Ka'b b. Suar brought out a Qur'an which was open in his hand, begging the people by Allah not to shed blood. (164) An arrow struck and killed him. (165) Perhaps it was the same with Talha. It is known that in the strife and the slaughter of the battle, those who had feuds and rancour were able to undo bonds and break agreements. The terms were at hand and the promises were carried out. (166)

If it is said, why did `A'isha go out when the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, had told them in the Hajj of Farewell, "After this, confinement (busr) will appear." (167)

We say: (relate two hadith to a woman. If she refuses, then make them four.) Oh intellects of women! Did I not enjoin you not to relate false hadith? (We already brought forward to you clear proof for the correctness of Aisha’s action)* (168)

As for what you mentioned about the testimony regarding Ma' al- Hawa`ib, you have committed the greatest sin (169) in mentioning it. There is absolutely nothing in what you mentioned. The Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, did not utter that hadith. Those words did not occur nor did anyone testify to them. You have written your testimonies with this falsehood and you will be questioned.

==================================================

152. `Uthman b. Hanif was an Ansari from `Aws. When the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, emigrated to Madina, he was one of fifteen `Awsi youths who joined Abu `Amr b. Sayfi when he went to Makka, because he was angry with the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace. Abu `Amr was called the "Monk" in the Jahiliyya. The Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, called him "al-Fasiq (the deviant)", (at-Tabari, 3:16). It is clear that `Uthman b. Hanif returned from Makka and became muslim before Uhud because it was the first of his battles (Isaba 2:249). The Shi'a claim that he rebelled against the Khalif of the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, Abu Bakr as-Siddiq at the beginning of his Khalifate. (`The Revision of the Article', by al-Mamqani (1:197). He believed that he was one of those they lied about. He was in charge of the sector of the land of Iraq and collecting its jizya and kharaj taxes for `Umar. If what they claim about his agitating Abu Bakr is true, this would conflict with `Umar's appointment of him unless he had repented of that.
When homage was given to `Ali at the end of 35 A.H. and he chose his governors at the beginnng of 36 A.H., he appointed `Uthman b. Hanif over Basra (at-Tabari, 5:161). When the People of the Camel reached al-Hafir, about four miles from Basra, `Uthman b. Hanif sent `Imran b. Husayn al-Khuza'i, the bearer of the banner of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, for Khuza'a on the Day of the Conquest of Makka, to them to investigate them for him. When he came back to him and mentioned his conversation with the People of the Camel `Uthman b. Hanif told him, "Advise me, `Imran." He told him, "I am not going out, so you should refrain". `Uthman said, "I will stop them until the Amir al-Mu'minin `Ali comes" Hisham b. `Amr al-Ansari, one of the people of jihad in the Conquest, indicated that he should make peace with them until `Ali's command came. `Uthman b. Hanif refused and sommoned the people. "Put on your weapons!" `Uthman occupied himself with deceit (5:174-175). His end was unsuccessful and he lost power to the People of the Camel. Ibn Hanif was captured by the mob and his beard was plucked out. Then the People of the Camel rescued him from them. He retreated to the army of `Ali which was in ath-Tha'labiyya and then in Dhu Qar. This was `Uthman b. Hanif and his position with the People of the Camel. As for Hukaym b. Jabala, the reader already knowns that he was one of those who murdered the Amir al-Mu'minin `Uthman. This was already stated earlier.

153. Az-Zabuqa: a place near Basra. The first stage of the Battle of the Camel took place there after Talha, az-Zubayr and `A'isha had spoken in al-Murbadd. As for the death of Hukaym b. Jabala, that was after the first battle which ended in the victory of the People of the Camel and they had power in Basra. Hukaym b. Jabala was insolent in this new situation and he fought with three hundred of his helpers until he was killed.

154. i.e. fighting

155. Murbadd of Basra: the place where the camel-market was held, outside of the city. Then it was the place where the poets boasted and the assemblies of the orators were held. Then the buildings of Basra expanded and al-Murbadd became part of its inhabited areas. It was one of its most glorious streets and its market was one of its greatest markets. It became an immense quarter, full of people. When the position of Basra declined and its buidlings grew old, it dwindled. Al-Murbadd became separate from it until there were three miles between it and Basra in the time of Yaqut. Al-Murbadd is a ruin. It is like a city isolated in the middle of the desert. The location of Basra at that time was near the place of the modern suburb, az-Zubayr

156. The People of the Camel were on the right of al-Murbadd and `Uthman b. Hanif and those with him were on the left of it. At- Tabari (5:175) gave a summary of the speeches of Talha, az- Zubayr, and `A'isha. He quoted that from Sayf b. `Umar at-Tamimi from his shaykhs. They are the historians who have the best knowledge of events in Iraq.

157. Because those who were on the left spoke while Talha and az- Zubayr were speaking. They said, "They have split! they are treacherous! They are speaking lies and command what is false! They gave homage and now they come saying this!" Those who were on the right were saying, "They are truthful! They are dutiful! They speak the truth and command the truth!" People broke up and threw pebbles at each other and spoke sharply. However, when `A'isha finished her speech, those with the Camel were firm in their constancy, but the people of `Uthman b. Hanif split into two groups. One group said, "She spoke the truth, by Allah, she is pious and has brought what is correct." The others said, "You lie! We do not recognise what you say." They broke up and threw pebbles at each other.

158. When `A'isha saw what the helpers of `Uthman b. Hanif did, she went down with the people of the right side, they left Ibn Hanif and stood elsewhere. Some of those who were with Ibn Hanif went with `A'isha, others remaied with `Uthman b. Hanif (at- Tabari, 5:175).

159. At-Tabari (5:176-177)has a fine description which Sayf b. `Umar at-Tamimi transmitted from his two shaykhs, Muhammad b. `Abdulah b. Suwad b. Nuwayra and Talha b. al-`A'lam al-Hanafi about the sound position of the People of the Camel in this battle and the excess of Hukaym b. Jabala when he started the fight. They both said, "`A'isha commanded her companions and they went to the right, to the cemetery of the Banu Mazin. Then night separated the two groups. The following day, the People of the Camel moved to the side of Dar ar-Razq. In the morning, `Uthman b. Hanif and Hukaym b. Jabala renewed the fight. Hukaym continued to curse the Umm al-Muminin, `A'isha, and he killed the men and women who censured him for that. `A'isha's herald told people not to fight, they refused when evil touched them and held to them, then the companions of `A'isha called for peace.

160. He camped in a place there called az-Zuwiya. The People of the Camel camped in a place called al-Furda.

161. In the place where the castle of `Ubaydullah b. Ziyad is located. That was Thursday in the middle of Jumada al-Akhira, 36 A.H. (at-Tabari, 5:199). The lofty Companion al-Qa'qa' b. `Amr at-Tamimi stood between the two groups attempting intelligent mediation. The People of the Camel answered him and `Ali submitted to that as well. `Ali sent to Talha and az-Zubayr saying, "If you still hold to what you told al-Qa'qa'a `Amr, then hold off until we come and investigate this matter." They sent to him, "We hold to what we told al-Qa'qa' b. `Amr regarding peace between the people." Ibn Kathir said in `The Beginning and the End' (7:239), people were reassured and tranquil. Each group gathered with its people. In the evening, `Ali sent `Abdullah b. `Abbas to them. They sent Muhammad b. Talha as-Sajjad to `Ali. They all decided on peace and spent the best night they had ever spent in well being. Those who had agitated in the business of `Uthman spent the worst night they had ever spent. They were looking in the face of destruction. They began to consult each other for the entire night until they agreed to start the war secretly. They concealed that, fearing that the evil they desired would become known. They went out in th dark of night so that their neighbours would not be aware of them. They slipped into that business. As well as `The History' of Ibn Kathir, look at `The History' of at- Tabari (5:202-203) and `The Path of the Sunna' (2:185 and 3:225& 241). That is how they started the war between `Ali and his brothers, az-Zubayr and Talha. The People of the Camel thought that `Ali had deceived them. `Ali thought that his brothers had deceived him. Each of them had too much fear of Allah to do that even in the jahiliyya. How then could they do it after they had reached the highest rank of the qualities of the Qur'an?

162. The bane of reports are their transmitters. In Islamic knowledge, there is a cure for the bane of false lies. Every person who relates a report is demanded by Islam to specify his source according to the rule, "From where did you get this?" No community knows precision like this in seeking only the sources of reports as the muslims knew it, especially the people of the Sunna among them. This report from Talha and Marwan is "picked up." Neither his father nor his Companion is known. Since no one reliable transmitted it with a known isnad from reliable men, Qadi Ibn al-`Arabi can say with deep conviction, "Who knows this except the One who knows the Unseen Worlds?"Who knows this except the one who knows the Unseen Worlds since no reliable source transmitted it?

163. This claim is like the previous claim from az-Zubayr that al-Ahnaf was the one who commanded his murder

164. Ka'b b. Suwar al-Azdi was the first of the Qadis of the muslims in Basra. The Amir al-Mu'minin `Umar appointed him. Ibn `Abdu'r-Barr said, "He was a muslim in the time of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, although he did not see him."

165. Ibn `Asakir (7:85) said in the biography of Talha, "`A'isha said to Ka`b b. Suwar al-Azdi, "Leave the camel, Ka'b. Bring the Book of Allah and call them to it." She gave him a Qur'an and he went forward to the people. The Saba'ites were in front of him. They feared that there would be peace. Ka'b confronted them with the Qur'an while `Ali was behind them, urging them (to accept). They refused to do anything but advance. When Ka'b called them, they shot him once and killed him. Then they shot at the Umm al- Mu'minin. The first thing which she did when they refused was to say, "Oh people! Curse the murderers of `Uthman and their parties." She began to supplicate and the people of Basra shouted out the curse. `Ali heard the invocation and said, "What is this shouting?" They said, "`A'isha is calling and the people of Basra are praying with her against the murderers of `Uthman and their parties." `Ali began to call, "Oh Allah, curse the murderers of `Uthman and their parties!" I said, "The men of right action of both parties shared in cursing the murderers of the Amir al- Mu'minin, the wronged martyr, in the very hour in which the murderers of `Uthman started the battle between the muslim men of right action.

166. Ibn `Asakir (7:86-87) quoted the words of ash-Sha`bi, "`Ali b. Abi Talib saw Talha fallen down in one of the valleys. He got down and wiped the dust from his face. Then he said, "Abu Muhmmad, it pains me to see you in the dust in a valley under the stars of the sky. I complain to Allah of all my hidden faults." (Al-Asma'i said, i.e. my secrets and my sorrows which are inside of me.) He said, "Would that I had died twenty years before this day!" Abu Hubayba, the client of Talha, said, "I and `Imran b. Talha came to `Ali after the Camel. He greeted `Imran and brought him there. He said, `I hope that Allah will put me and your father among those about whom it is said, "We stripped away all rancour in their hearts as brothers, they are on couches face to face.""' Al-Harith al-A`war (Abu Zuhayr al-Harith b. `Abdullah al-Hamdani al-Hawthi al-Kufi' al-A'war, one of the great men of the Shi`a. Ash-Sha`bi and Ibn al-Madini said that he was a liar.) was sitting in a corner. He said, "Allah is too just to let us kill them when they will be our brothers in the Garden." `Ali said to him, "Go to the furthest and most remote land of Allah!" "Who will be there if Talha and I are not in the Garden?" Muhammad b. `Abdulah mentioned that `Ali took an inkwell and threw it at al-`Awar but it missed him. Ibn al-Kiwa' (`Abdullah b. Abi Awfa al-Yashkuri, one of those who formed the sedition after `Uthman. After Siffin and the Arbitration, he was at the head of the Kharijites. He returned to `Ali before the Battle of Nahrawan. Said to him, "Allah is too just for that." `Ali went at him with a stick and beat him. He said to him, "You! You have no mother! Your companions deny this?!"

167. In the `Musnad' of Ahmad (2:446, first edition) from the hadith of Salih, the client of Tawa'ma from Abu Hurayra that when the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, went on Hajj with his wives, he said, "It is this Hajj. The time of the appearance of confinement comes after it." In it (5:218, first edition) there is the hadith of Waqid b. Abi Waqid al- Laythi from his father that he, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said to his wive in this Hajj, "After this, confinement will appear." The hadith of Abu Waqid is in the chapter of `The Obligation of the Hajj' from `The Book of Practices in the Sunan' of Abu Da`ud (book 11, chap. 1). `Husur' is the plural of `hasir', i.e. staying in the house. Ibn Kathir transmitted it in `The Beginning and the End' (5:215), saying that it is an indication by the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, that he himself announced his death to them and that this would be his last Hajj, may Allah bless him and grant him peace. In it, he does not commend that they should not leave confinement for a Hajj or a requirement or to make peace between people. The enemies of the Companions quoted this hadith as an absolute prohibition. Qadi Ibn al-`Arabi considered that to be a lie because it is quoted in order to use it in a manner other than that desired by the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace.

168. In the research on `The Aspects of Excellence and Preference' from `The Book of the Imamate and Preference', included in part 4 of `The Fisal', p. 134, Imam Ibn Hazm quoted his shaykh Ahmad b. Muhammad al-Khawzi from Ahmad b. al-Fadl ad-Dinawari from Muhammad b. Jarir at-Tabari that `Ali b. Abi Talib sent `Ammar b. Yasir and al-Hasan b. `Ali to Kufa when the Umm al- Mu'minin went to Basra. When they came there, people gathered to both of them in the mosque. `Ammar spoke to them and told them that `A'isha, the Umm al-Mu'minin, had gone out to Basra. Then he said to them, "I tell you, by Allah, I know that she is the wife of the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, in the Garden, as she was his wife in this world, but Allah has tested you by her so that you either obey her or obey him." Masruq (or Abu'l-Aswad) said to him, "Abu'l-Yaqathan, we are with those who are promised the Garden rather than those who are not promised it." `Ammar was silent.
Why do you say what you do not know? You repeat something you should disassociate yourself from, as if you did not understand. "The worst of beasts with Allah are the deaf and dumb who do not understand."

169. Hub: wrong action, sin.

* I have changed the translation here and put it between paranthesis


Edited by Fatah-Momin
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