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Islamic INTRAfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Islamic INTRAfaith Dialogue
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rami
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Quote rami Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2005 at 12:54am
Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem

The work originaly published in Arabic it was translated and indexed by my friend in english on my request, refrences are already within the posts.

What is the name of the work it self that your friend authored and the author himself not whohe is quoting.

When you refrence a work you give the title of the work you your self are copying from not where Author of the book you are quoting is getting his information from. after that is done then you say the source for his views are tabari, ibn hajar etc. You dont say this is from ibn hajar directly which is what you are doing by not clearly saying the title of the work and the name of its author.

i have no problem with the sources i know who they are but i would like to know the name of the work you are getting the information from directly.

Are you saying your friend is of the same status as tabari?

^ where did this come from?

it came from here,

Yes this is translation from Arabic to english directly from the work of scholar like At-Tabari and other.






Edited by rami
Rasul Allah (sallah llahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "Whoever knows himself, knows his Lord" and whoever knows his Lord has been given His gnosis and nearness.
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AhmadJoyia
 
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Quote AhmadJoyia Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2005 at 8:57am
Originally posted by Fatah-Momin

You say "proceed with caution" and when I do you say  "conclusion that fears me alot from too precautionary a note" Make up your mind, which route you want to take.

Oh, what a correlation of my two posts in two different contexts at two different threads? Is this logical? Though, in both of my quotes, it is "cuation" that I preferred and not "too precautionary", only if anyone has sane understanding of the two opposites. Nevertheless, I do see you avoiding my questions on this thread, in totality, without giving any reasonable reply. Should I conclude that either you don't know the answer or are hiding facts with some "hidden agenda"? I leave the matter to Allah to decide. Indeed only Allah knows the best. 

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Fatah-Momin
 
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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2005 at 11:05pm

rami,

You asked me to provied refrences, there are refrences in every post now, if you doubt any please look it up and post it here. That is all I can suggest. As I have not been able to understand the motive for your line of objection. I have not claimed I or my friend to be a scholar of any degree. We do read books written by scholars.

You do have the right to post your version of the history, if you want to use this thread please go head, or you can initiate your own thread.

 

rami:When you refrence a work you give the title of the work you your self are copying from not where Author of the book you are quoting is getting his information from. after that is done then you say the source for his views are tabari, ibn hajar etc. You dont say this is from ibn hajar directly which is what you are doing by not clearly saying the title of the work and the name of its author.

 

These are direct quotes from the books and sources mentioned.




Edited by Fatah-Momin
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rami
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Quote rami Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2005 at 11:38pm
Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem

i think we are misunderstanding each other.

What i understand from your comments so far,

Your friend compiled a historical work which was published in arabic and translated into english and you are posting it on this forum.

You are not giving the name of this work or the author but the refrences he has gotton his infomation from.

Is this correct.

Otherwise you personaly are reading tabari and ibn hajar etc, meaning there original works are in front of you and you personaly are quoting from there works directly.

i dont see any other posability.
Rasul Allah (sallah llahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "Whoever knows himself, knows his Lord" and whoever knows his Lord has been given His gnosis and nearness.
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Fatah-Momin
 
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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 23 November 2005 at 6:26am

rami: Your friend compiled a historical work which was published in arabic and translated into english and you are posting it on this forum.

^ I never claimed this, what I said was that he translate Arabic work for me when I require it for a specific article, as I do not know Arabic language.

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Fatah-Momin
 
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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 23 November 2005 at 6:27am

Find below the work of one of the most respected shia scholar Mullah Baqir Majlisi:

Hazrat Ameer Maveeyah(ra) advice his son Yazeed


However, none of the books relating the tragic event contains a single expression clearly stating that those two Khalfas were smeared with the blessed blood of Hadrat Husayn. Not even the vaguest implication that Hadrat Muwiya might have had to do with the martyrdom of Hadrat Husayn has been witnessed throughout the literature assigned to the event, let alone a clear statement that it was done by his order. What is unanimously stated (by all books and scholars) is that the martyrdom of Hadrat Husayn did not take place during the caliphate of Hadrat Muwiya. Molla Bqir Mejls, relates Hadrat Muwiyas last advice to his son Yazd as he was dying, as follows:

You know what relation Imm Husayn radiy-Allhu anh is to the Messenger of Allah. He is a part from the beloved Prophets blessed body. He is an offspring from the flesh and blood of that most honourable person. I understand that the inhabitants of Iraq invite him to go there and be with them. But they will not help him; they will leave him alone. If he should fall into your hands, behave in appreciation of his value! Remember the closeness and affection of the Messenger of Allah sall-Allhu alaihi wa sallam to him! Do not get back at him for his behaviour! Mind you dont break the substantial ties I have established between him and us! Be extra careful lest you should hurt or offend him! This advice of Hadrat Muwiyas to (his son) Yazd is written in the three hundred and twenty-first (321) page of the book Jil-uluyn, which was written by Muhammad Bqir bin Murtad Fayz Khorasn, a Shiite leader, who is better known with his nickname Molla Muhsin. He died in 1091 [1679 A.D.].

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Fatah-Momin
 
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Quote Fatah-Momin Replybullet Posted: 24 November 2005 at 12:05am

rami

Here is a example I wanted a peice of history translated for an on going debate a friend of mine got  material from shia source, which I could not locate on the english sites,

.
( 3 ) ( 4 ) :

http://www.shiabooks.info/books/htm1/m013/13/no1304.html
`Allamah Majlisi said: "Some scholars have asserted that ibn Saba was a Jew who accepted Islam and started voicing his opinion of the `wilayat' (divine appointment) of `Ali. While a Jew, he propounded the exaggerative notion that Yusha ibn Nun was divinely appointed to succeed Prophet Musa, he thus adopted a similar stance with regard to `Ali in relation to the Holy Prophet. He was the first to subscribe to the belief of Imamate, and he openly vitriolated his enemies (i.e. the first three Caliphs) and branded them as infidels. The origin of Shi'ism and rafidizm is thus based on Judaism." (Bihar al-Anwar, vol. 25, p. 287).

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rami
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Quote rami Replybullet Posted: 24 November 2005 at 6:53am
Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem

so more acuratly it should be

Otherwise you personaly are reading tabari and ibn hajar etc, meaning there original works are in front of you and you personaly are quoting from there works directly which you get your friend to translate into english for you.

So you are the one compiling the information from the works of these scholars but using your friend to translate arabic to english.

are these works of tabari and ibn hajar ie the clasical scholars online or do you have copies your self, if online im interested in getting access to them.


Rasul Allah (sallah llahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "Whoever knows himself, knows his Lord" and whoever knows his Lord has been given His gnosis and nearness.
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