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Islam for non-Muslims
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Message Icon Topic: The Miracle of Adam and Jesus Post Reply Post New Topic
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samirfaithful
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Quote samirfaithful Replybullet Topic: The Miracle of Adam and Jesus
    Posted: 04 January 2014 at 7:40am

Miraculously, the name of Jesus, PBUH, is repeated in the holy Qur’an 25 …


Allah, the almighty says in the holy Qur’an:

The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was.” Al-i-Imran: 3: 59

Miraculously, the name of Jesus, PBUH, is repeated in the holy Qur’an 25 times and the name of Adam, PBUH, is repeated 25 times as well. It’s worth noting here that the seventh Qur’anic verse in which the name of Jesus, PBUH, is mentioned is exactly the same verse in which the name of Adam, PBUH, is mentioned. Besides, the nineteenth verse (out of 25 verses) in which the name of Adam, PBUH, is mentioned is in chapter 19,Mariam (Mary), and the name of Jesus, PBUH, is also mentioned for the nineteenth time in the same chapter, Mary. The question that needs be answered here is whether this is a mere coincidence or a miracle?

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By: Abduldaem Al-Kaheel

www.kaheel7.com/eng

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Lachi
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Quote Lachi Replybullet Posted: 21 March 2014 at 9:53am
As a non-Muslim, and no disrespect intended for anyone's beliefs, but I would first wonder whether it was evidence of intentional editing.


Edited by Lachi - 21 March 2014 at 9:55am
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islamispeace
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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 22 March 2014 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by Lachi

As a non-Muslim, and no disrespect intended for anyone's beliefs, but I would first wonder whether it was evidence of intentional editing.


Do you have any proof of this? 
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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schmikbob
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Quote schmikbob Replybullet Posted: 22 March 2014 at 1:33pm
I find it interesting that you ask for proof of Lachi's wondering and yet ask for no proof for samirfaithful's claims of miraculous numerology. Could you tell me why?
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islamispeace
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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 23 March 2014 at 7:30pm
Originally posted by schmikbob

I find it interesting that you ask for proof of Lachi's wondering and yet ask for no proof for samirfaithful's claims of miraculous numerology. Could you tell me why?


Um, I actually did check to see if samirfaithful's numbers lined up.  Did you?  All the claims made in his post are correct.  You can verify it yourself.

On the other hand, Lachi made a claim and I asked him for proof.  I don't think that is unreasonable.  Isn't it fair to ask him for proof for his claim that the numbers only line up because someone did some "intentional editing"?  The burden of proof is on him, is it not?
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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schmikbob
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Quote schmikbob Replybullet Posted: 23 March 2014 at 7:39pm
Actually, I didn't ask you if his numbers lined up. I asked you why you didn't question his claim that these things amounted to a miracle. The question still stands. Do you feel that these things amount to a miracle?
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Lachi
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Quote Lachi Replybullet Posted: 24 March 2014 at 4:11pm
I wasn't doubting that the names of Adam and Jesus appear in the Quran as samirfaithful says. Only that just because they appear like that it doesn't mean it is a miracle. The alternatives are coincidence (as noted by samirfaithful) or intentional editing.

Evidence for intentional editing? You'll need to look into the history of the Quran and the compilations by Ali ibn Ali Talib and Zaid ibn Thabit and others.
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islamispeace
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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 24 March 2014 at 6:22pm
Originally posted by schmikbob

Actually, I didn't ask you if his numbers lined up. I asked you why you didn't question his claim that these things amounted to a miracle. The question still stands. Do you feel that these things amount to a miracle?


No, you asked me why I didn't ask for proof of samirfaithful's claims of a miracle.  I responded by pointing out that I actually verified all the claims made in his post.  The names of Adam and Jesus indeed appear 25 times and the 19th occurrence of each name is indeed in the 19th surah.  This is all easily verifiable.

Now you are asking a different question.  Do I think that the alignment of Adam and Jesus' names are a miracle?  In my view, this example, by itself, is not sufficient to claim as a miracle.  It could just be due to coincidence.  If more such examples could be found, then it would be a different story.  The more examples, the less likely it is a coincidence, and hence the more likely that it is indeed miraculous.  That would require more research.

In Lachi's case, he simply made a statement and did not provide the evidence.  I don't think I was being unreasonable to ask him for proof of "intentional editing".   
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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