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Interfaith Dialogue
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iec786
 
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Quote iec786 Replybullet Posted: 02 December 2013 at 10:52am
Hi Placid,

You are a master dodger.

You cleverly avoided my post and put some silly thing of Mary in the Quran when we were discussing the genealogy of Jesus.

Pharez and Zarah which were the children of incest were the great grandparents of Jesus according to your Bible.
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Quote Placid Replybullet Posted: 03 December 2013 at 12:41pm
In the genealogy of Jesus why don’t we go by the Quran which says that Mary was the daughter of ‘Imran and his wife. --- There was no incest, was there?.

Why don’t you follow their ancestry back to King David?
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Quote iec786 Replybullet Posted: 04 December 2013 at 10:06pm
Originally posted by Placid

In the genealogy of Jesus why don’t we go by the Quran which says that Mary was the daughter of ‘Imran and his wife. --- There was no incest, was there?.

Why don’t you follow their ancestry back to King David?




Hi Placid,

Lol what happened to the biblical version??knocked the wind out of you.You are a Christian now admit the Quranic version makes more sense.
iec
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Quote Placid Replybullet Posted: 09 December 2013 at 5:44am
Hi iec,

I had given you the Genealogy from Matthew which was of Joseph, And the Genealogy of Mary in Luke.
Luke was the Greek historian who "had perfect understanding from the beginning," --- so once it is presented it is accepted or rejected.

The descendants were always recorded from the male and Joseph was named as the father in the census in Bethlehem, in Matthew. and it says, - "Joseph the husband of Mary to whom was born Jesus who is called Christ." --- In Luke it says, "Jesus, (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, the son of Heli."

The (as was supposed) indicates that Jesus was not the biological son of Joseph, --- and a look at Matthew's Genealogy of Joseph says that "Mathan begat Jacob, and Jacob begat Joseph, the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus."
--- So the Genealogy in Luke is of Mary, and Joseph was Heli's 'son in law.' --- My son in law calls me Father all the time.

This is what gave rise to these verses in Surah 19:
27 At length she brought the (babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms). They said: "O Mary! truly an amazing thing hast thou brought!
28 "O sister of Aaron! Thy father was not a man of evil, nor thy mother a woman unchaste!"
29 But she pointed to the babe. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?"
30 He said: "I am indeed a servant of God: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet;
31 "And He hath made me blessed wheresoever I be, and hath enjoined on me Prayer and Charity as long as I live;

--- Do you think there was any question about His origin when He spoke from the cradle?

But on the negative side notice this in Surah 4:
156 That they rejected Faith; that they uttered against Mary a grave false charge;

--- This speaks of the Jews who condemned Jesus before Pilate and the Romans took Jesus and had Him crucified,
At first the Jews boasted that 'they killed Him' but after He was Resurrected, they wanted to deny it.

157 That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Apostle of God"; - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not.

--- The Jews did not kill Jesus, but they condemned Him. The Romans who carried out the crucifixion did not kill Him, but as you read in all four Gospels, when all prophecies were fulfilled concerning Him, he said, "It is finished," --- meaning 'God's plan of salvation was complete,' and 'He gave up His spirit.'

--- Jesus had to die, in order to be Resurrected, and the Power and victory over 'sin, Satan, and death,' was in the Resurrection.

If you don't want to believe it then you can pray for clarification from God.

Placid

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Quote iec786 Replybullet Posted: 12 December 2013 at 12:26pm
Originally posted by Placid

Hi iec,

I had given you the Genealogy from Matthew which was of Joseph,Why was Joseph the father of Jesus??if not why the genealogy of Joseph?? And the Genealogy of Mary in Luke.
Luke was the Greek historian who "had perfect understanding from the beginning,"No he did not have perfect understanding.All he did was write an orderly account of what he heard. --- so once it is presented it is accepted or rejected.rejected.

The descendants were always recorded from the male and Joseph was named as the father in the census in Bethlehem,by who???God?? in Matthew. and it says, - "Joseph the husband of Mary to whom was born Jesus who is called Christ."where does it say and Joseph is the father of Jesus??? --- In Luke it says, "Jesus, (as was supposed)why the brackets,because they did not no. the son of Joseph, the son of Heli."

The (as was supposed) indicates that Jesus was not the biological son of Joseph,Then why his genealogy??? --- and a look at Matthew's Genealogy of Joseph says that "Mathan begat Jacob, and Jacob begat Joseph, the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus."not relevant.
--- So the Genealogy in Luke is of Mary,where does it say and this is the genealogy of Mary??? you just thumbsuck. and Joseph was Heli's 'son in law.' --- My son in law calls me Father all the time.not relevant.

This is what gave rise to these verses in Surah 19:
27 At length she brought the (babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms). They said: "O Mary! truly an amazing thing hast thou brought!
28 "O sister of Aaron!Harun and not Aaron Thy father was not a man of evil, nor thy mother a woman unchaste!"
29 But she pointed to the babe. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?"
30 He said: "I am indeed a servant of God: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet;
31 "And He hath made me blessed wheresoever I be, and hath enjoined on me Prayer and Charity as long as I live;

--- Do you think there was any question about His origin when He spoke from the cradle?no no question.

But on the negative side notice this in Surah 4:
156 That they rejected Faith; that they uttered against Mary a grave false charge; The mischief makers and they knew the truth.hypocrites.

--- This speaks of the Jews who condemned Jesus before Pilate and the Romans took Jesus and had Him crucified,your opinion.
At first the Jews boasted that 'they killed Him' but after He was Resurrected, they wanted to deny it.

157 That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Apostle of God"; - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not.

--- The Jews did not kill Jesus, but they condemned Him.We know they did not kill him. The Romans who carried out the crucifixion did not kill Him, but as you read in all four Gospels, when all prophecies were fulfilled concerning Him, he said, "It is finished," --- meaning 'God's plan of salvation was complete,' and 'He gave up His spirit.'That is according to the Bible.You know what is fascinating?at the time of the entire play it says that there was an earthquake and all his disciples forsook him and fled.60 miles an hough so who witnessed this fantastic storey because all means all in any language all forsook him and fled.

--- Jesus had to die, in order to be Resurrected,
Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, and the Power and victory over 'sin, Satan, and death,' was in the Resurrection.New International Version
Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment,
If you die once it is over till judgment day period.


If you don't want to believe it then you can pray for clarification from God.

Placid

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Quote Placid Replybullet Posted: 16 December 2013 at 3:56pm
Hi iec,

Questons on the Seed of David:
** 1 Why was Joseph the father of Jesus?? if not why the genealogy of Joseph??

Response: Joseph was engaged to Mary. This is how it is written in Matthew 1:
18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was as follows: After His mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Spirit.
19 Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not wanting to make her a public example, was minded to put her away secretly.
20 But while he thought about these things, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take to you Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit.
21 And she will bring forth a Son, and you shall call His name Jesus, for He will save His people from their sins.”
24 Then Joseph, did as the angel of the Lord commanded him and took to him his wife,
25 and did not know her till she had brought forth her firstborn Son. And he called His name Jesus.
--- (So it was by God’s arrangement that Joseph was a descendant of King David through Solomon, and that he became the foster father of Jesus.)

** 2 And the Genealogy of Mary in Luke, shows that she descended from King David through another son, Nathan. Luke was the Greek historian who "had perfect understanding from the beginning,"
(And you said, “No he did not have perfect understanding.”)
--- But a historian writes as things happen, and he would have known Joseph and Mary and would get information from them about the Birth of Jesus in Bethlehem.

--- Notice, he said in Luke 1:
1 “Inasmuch as ‘MANY’ have taken in hand to set in order a narrative of those things which have been ‘FULFILLED’ among us,
2 just as those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and ministers of the word delivered them to us,
3 it seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first.
--- (He would have been an ‘eye witness’ himself and lived with the ‘eye witnesses’ in Jerusalem --- and would have access to ‘ALL’ that was written. --- He also wrote an intro in his Book of Acts and later joined Paul on his missionary journeys, --- and then they went to Rome together.)

** 3 Joseph was named as the father in the census in Bethlehem, by who???God??

Response: --- It gives the info in Luke 2:
1 And it came to pass in those days that a decree went out from Caesar Augustus that all the world should be registered.
2 This census first took place while Quirinius was governing Syria.
3 So all went to be registered, everyone to his own city.
4 Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judea, to the city of David, which is called Bethlehem, because he was of the house and lineage of David,
5 to be registered with Mary, his wife, who was with child.
6 So it was, that while they were there, the days were completed for her to be delivered.
7 And she brought forth her firstborn Son, and wrapped Him in swaddling cloths, and laid Him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn.
--- (So it was the census by the Roman Government that would record Joseph as the father of Jesus, because the lineage was taken through the father.
--- So Jesus was recorded as the Son of Joseph, the carpenter.)

Placid
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Quote iec786 Replybullet Posted: 19 December 2013 at 10:18am
16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you[a] this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”
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Quote iec786 Replybullet Posted: 16 February 2014 at 12:43pm
Hi Placid,

who was the father of Jesus?????
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