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whitelion553
 
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Quote whitelion553 Replybullet Posted: 01 June 2013 at 4:11am
Clap Salam ,My post caused that u be curious and find its resource .i am happy for it. thanks . this title is only an alarm for being caution .i didnt put all of article for i thought this short title is better than long article.i must say its adress ,it was my wrong for that thanks again from ur comment .
i try to say only facts
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whitelion553
 
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Quote whitelion553 Replybullet Posted: 18 June 2013 at 12:00am
i try to say only facts
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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 18 June 2013 at 5:27pm
 
This little statement by Ayatollah Shirazi is filled is a fascinating study in Orwellian double-speak.  Notice how he uses the sugar-coated word "awakening", when he really means jihad.  Notice also the word "unity" as a euphemism for dictatorship, while "disunity" is the negative label he attaches to freedom of thought and independence of action. 
 
When Shirazi calls for Muslims to be united, he is calling them to be united under him -- to submit to his authority and the authority of his fellow (like-minded) clerics.  Perhaps he has forgotten that Muslims submit only to Allah. 
 
I still believe that this is exactly what Allah had in mind when He warned against shirk.  Shirazi wants Muslims to submit to him, as if he speaks with the authority of Allah.  But Allah speaks for Himself.  He does not need partners.


Edited by Ron Webb - 18 June 2013 at 5:28pm
Addeenul ĎAql Ė Religion is intellect.
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whitelion553
 
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Quote whitelion553 Replybullet Posted: 20 June 2013 at 2:12am

Greeting Ron Webb,

I read ur comment but really didnít understand ur mind .why u think such about this statements ???in all of it ,I didnít see any word against words of Allah. All of us know that Muslims must only obey orders of Allah . If one person speak about untity,u think that  he wants to be instead of Allah. Is it possible?????????????????????i think inviting to unity  is duty of all Muslims and this duty is not bad .it is very valuable and we cant have negative mind to it.I want u to read it again ,please.

 

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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 20 June 2013 at 7:29pm
What do you think Shirazi means by "unity"?  If there is disunity, how do you think Shirazi wants to resolve it?  Is he going to change to conform with those who disagree with him?  Not likely!
 
No, when a leader calls for unity, it is a call for everyone else to conform to the leader's position or beliefs.  Anyone who refuses -- anyone who insists on thinking for himself and opposing the leaders -- is automatically responsible for the "disunity" that Shirazi warns against.  It is a ploy common to all dictators.
Addeenul ĎAql Ė Religion is intellect.
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whitelion553
 
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Quote whitelion553 Replybullet Posted: 21 June 2013 at 3:57am

Salam

Ur opinion is interesting for me .if I understand well, u say every one that speaks about unity wants to govern such dictators .this means when a religious one  speaks  a bout peace  or unity ,real mind of him is dominance or becoming dictator for receiving his personal goals. Am I right? but I ask u one question .where is our ability for thinking and selection. We r not robot and any one cant dictate his personal wants to us .we r human and we have very important state in this world .Insan is substitute of Allah on the earth .for this reason ,I cant accept that we must obey from wrong .i believe we must try to clean all of wrongs . u say  Ayatollah Shirazi  speaks like dictators .can u clear for me dictator for which mind, which nation, which country. dictator for all of Muslims by inviting to unity and brotherhood ?all humans by inviting to peace and safety ?dictator for all the world by inviting to respect to religions and humans?

I was thinking all dictators only wants wealth, money ,power ,wasting treasure of country for their dreams ,long life ,gathering asset for future of their children , wantonness, killing guiltless humans ,ignoring poor and disable persons ,ignoring wants of nation ,ignoring humanity and all of its rules andÖ.

Ron webb ,I am disagree with ur thought and donít know why u think such .i think all of people know better than me that they have an  special ability that Allah forgave it to us .we have ability of thinking .we can think about every thing ,we can decide ,recognize  realities and good ways from bad ways. We understand what is fact and what is fancy .Muslims can feel which way is not suitable for their great religion and them. How??because we have a special and holy book that has orders of our dear Allah. Quran shows straight way to humans .it shows the best way .our dear prophet has said us orders of it in a  simple language for understanding of all people .prophet and Imams help  us to find the way .this cause that we dont  divert  .if we have problem in our life ,we must find its solution in words of them .is it frightening when a person speaks about unity and brotherhood or about awakening ?why when a western politicians  speak  about this ideals we believe them but when we hear this words from a Muslim ,we prefer to have a guard in front of him????????if some Islamic countries had or have tyrants in their government .it is for force. they didnít select their governors themselves .others (big global governments )selected them and their nation forced to accept .because they hadnít any way at that time and forced to obey .

Muslims know that a dictator cant be responsible of a Muslim nation .they know that their agents and governors must be honest , righteous and Ö .this is the real reason of Islamic awakening in Islamic countries .


Edited by whitelion553 - 21 June 2013 at 4:01am
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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 22 June 2013 at 8:20pm

Originally posted by whitelion553

Ur opinion is interesting for me .if I understand well, u say every one that speaks about unity wants to govern such dictators .this means when a religious one  speaks  a bout peace  or unity ,real mind of him is dominance or becoming dictator for receiving his personal goals. Am I right? but I ask u one question .where is our ability for thinking and selection. We r not robot and any one cant dictate his personal wants to us .

That is exactly what I am saying.  We can and should think for ourselves and select what we believe it true and right.  If that creates "disunity", then so be it.

Shirazi calls it "disunity", and he thinks it is bad.  I call it diversity, and to me it is good, or at least it is better than asking anyone to abandon their principles for the sake of some illusion of "unity".

u say  Ayatollah Shirazi  speaks like dictators .can u clear for me dictator for which mind, which nation, which country. dictator for all of Muslims by inviting to unity and brotherhood ?all humans by inviting to peace and safety ?dictator for all the world by inviting to respect to religions and humans?

I find it hard to believe that Shirazi has respect for religions other than Islam.  Or for any other version of Islam than his own, for that matter.

why when a western politicians  speak  about this ideals we believe them but when we hear this words from a Muslim ,we prefer to have a guard in front of him????????

It's true that many western politicians appeal to unity, for instance in condemning opposition to the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.  I feel the same way about them that I do about Shirazi and his fellow ayatollahs.  The politicians I vote for talk about diversity and freedom of conscience, not unity.

if some Islamic countries had or have tyrants in their government .it is for force. they didnít select their governors themselves .others (big global governments )selected them and their nation forced to accept .because they hadnít any way at that time and forced to obey .

And yet we are seeing in Afghanistan and Egypt and elsewhere that when Muslims are given the opportunity to choose their leaders, they generally choose the same kinds of tyrants, who impose "unity" through shariah law.



Edited by Ron Webb - 22 June 2013 at 8:21pm
Addeenul ĎAql Ė Religion is intellect.
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whitelion553
 
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Quote whitelion553 Replybullet Posted: 23 June 2013 at 9:22am

In the name of Allah.

Salam

We can speak about our differences and try to solve them in a fair way such two sides benefit from it and conclude common result .disunity always was bad because it is reason of all bad actions and events. I explain a clear example. In Pakistan ,terrorists misuse from disunity among Muslims .They create difference among Muslims by their lie and cause sensitivity among Muslims .terrorists know their  methods  because have cunning teachers .they kill and terror Muslims easily and at last say it was war among Sunni and Shia .This disunity caused thousands of guiltless Muslims became victim of terrorists (special during this year).this trick is not new for Muslims and all of us know that who donít want unity among Muslims .all of people that fear from power of Islam cant see this unity and want to disturb brotherhood among Muslims. Enemies of Islam must know Muslims r awake for this reason great religious persons of Iraq decided to pray with each other on Friday .Sunni and Shia prayed   hearty and didnít let to enemies get their wants. This excellent   movement was very heavy and  unbelievable for terrorists (terrorists failed) .But about diversity .diversity is very good .it makes progress .it cause we know new and fresh minds and thoughts and make better life(high quality).for example :when we go to travel with our friends ,enjoy from our travel  .why? because diversity of ideas .if we donít have unity in travel ,what will happen ?i think ,we will hate from being with them .first rule for a useful discussion is respect. Respect must be reasonable ,too .Islam is the best religion(number one   real).where is freedom ?where can we find it? in safe streets of west ?in universities? In google or facebook ?for example freedom in Canada :this government didnít let Iranians take part in election of Iran. This country like other countries banned Iran. western countries  banned Iranian channels from Intel Sat and Ö .freedom means listening to phones ?or searching in  personal information and Ö?streets r full of cameras  in most countries ,these r connect to police stations .i have a question ?when rabble hit and disturb Africans  and Asians, where is police? Where are police cars and dogs ?why some active politicians die for unknown reasons? For freedom ,a simple march is full of police and their equipment ?freedom means : repressing by water, chemical substance and nightstick ?how many students injured in universities for Wall Street ?they was saying that donít have money for studying .some of hopeless college students   killed themselves  or left universities . and about Afghanistan, i am very sorry for death of our dears in this country .unfortunately, we daily hear this bad news from our multi medias. Its reason is not their president .u must search its reason in American planes ,jets and army .western bombs ,rockets and guns kill guiltless women ,children ,workers and farmers  in their home ,farm ,mosques, shopping centers .we must ask reason of this  crimes from Taliban .we must ask :why they kill humans ?for what?why we cant live happily near each other ?why we cant enjoy from nice sky , clouds, colorful flowers and beautiful nature ?why we cant enjoy from our gifts? We must ask killing a little girl is nice or watching her playing with little animals and dolls ?they like flood but I want to say being under rain is better than it .i say all must enjoy from their life .i donít want to see happiness in face of people no fear .revolution of Egypt is newborn .so it needs to time for building of its basis and improving bad effects of past (time of Mobarak). All of political groups in Egypt  must discuss about their wants .they must  attend to wants of nation and respect to it, too .this country is very valuable for Muslims .if they act to orders of Islam ,I am certain they will be luck.

i try to say only facts
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