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Interfaith Dialogue
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honeto
 
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Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 02 May 2013 at 2:20pm
Placid,
I see you either confused or trying to be confusing or simply naive.
Of course, as a Muslim we believe Jesus to be a messenger from God, a man. Who came to correct and teach people about God just like prophets did before him.
There is nothing in the Quran that contradict of Jesus unlike the Christian teachings as we know them today.
I did not say anything against Jesus (pbuh). I refuse to accept anything about Jesus that is not true or does not have any authentic proof like the claim and blasphemy by some that he was God, or a begotten son of God.   Now that is a direct offense to God, and anyone uttering such blasphemy will see their words used against them one day.
So where do you stand?
Hasan
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
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Caringheart
 
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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 02 June 2013 at 10:35am
2:285 - We make no distinction between any of His messengers -

2:253 Of those messengers, some of whom We have caused to excel others, and of whom there are some unto whom Allah spake, while some of them He exalted (above others) in degree; and We gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear proofs (of Allah's Sovereignty) and We supported him with the holy Spirit. And if Allah had so wiled it, those who followed after them would not have fought one with another after the clear proofs had come unto them. But they differed, some of them believing and some disbelieving. And if Allah had so willed it, they would not have fought one with another; but Allah doeth what He will.

Contradiction/confusion in the qur'an.
 Does Allah make distinctions between His messengers?
285 should abrogate 253 according to Muhammad's(or allah's) directive.
Allah does not seem to know his own mind?

"And if Allah had so willed it, they would not have fought one with another; but Allah doeth what He will. "
So allah wanted them to fight with one another?

Who is this allah who so often changes his mind, and who wills it for us to fight with one another?

I can see that Muhammad led his people away from idolatry, but I can not see that he is a prophet of God.

Salaam.
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
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bronaz
 
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Quote bronaz Replybullet Posted: 03 June 2013 at 4:47am
Originally posted by honeto

Why would I believe a religion that teaches:
-God came on earth, was born, had his butt cleaned, who suckled a human mother.
-That this man god, was actually son of God who was with God before (God never mentioned He has anyone with him as God in the OT).
-That then this man god is killed by some people. No, actually he dies, so that with his blood he can pay for the sins of all the world (that's what it says in the Gospel).
-that after he (god) (some say son of god)died and paid for them, then his body disappeared, he was taken back to God, wait but they say he WAS God? So He went to Himself?

While in my mind, I cannot believe in any of the above.
Sorry, but I only know to be straight and this is what it comes down to.
Hasan

First of all God is omnipotent...which means he can do anything...which includes all of the above.  If you want to pick and choose what God can do...then he is a selective God and not an omnipotent one and hence not a true God.
While everyone will agree that Belief=Faith.
I however say Faith is the ability to get something done which cannot be done by any person.
In other words show me by your faith what works you are capable of and so will I. It is only then you will believe what is said about the Christian God Jesus to be true.
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Caringheart
 
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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 21 July 2013 at 8:50pm
What is this something else...
I have to say what keeps sticking in my mind is the cruel way in which Muhammad condoned the killing of Umm Qirfa.  For me this is no man of God.
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4 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. - 1 John



Edited by Caringheart - 21 July 2013 at 9:00pm
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
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truthnowcome
 
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Quote truthnowcome Replybullet Posted: 31 July 2013 at 9:23pm
Originally posted by Caringheart

2:285 - We make no distinction between any of His messengers -

2:253 Of those messengers, some of whom We have caused to excel others, and of whom there are some unto whom Allah spake, while some of them He exalted (above others) in degree; and We gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear proofs (of Allah's Sovereignty) and We supported him with the holy Spirit. And if Allah had so wiled it, those who followed after them would not have fought one with another after the clear proofs had come unto them. But they differed, some of them believing and some disbelieving. And if Allah had so willed it, they would not have fought one with another; but Allah doeth what He will.

Contradiction/confusion in the qur'an.
 Does Allah make distinctions between His messengers?
285 should abrogate 253 according to Muhammad's(or allah's) directive.
Allah does not seem to know his own mind?

"And if Allah had so willed it, they would not have fought one with another; but Allah doeth what He will. "
So allah wanted them to fight with one another?

Who is this allah who so often changes his mind, and who wills it for us to fight with one another?

I can see that Muhammad led his people away from idolatry, but I can not see that he is a prophet of God.

Salaam.
Peace my friend!

Jesus said unto them (Jews), Did ye never read in the scriptures, the stone which the builders reject the same is become the head of the corner: This is the Lord’s doings, and it is marvelous in our eyes. Therefore say I unto you The kingdom of God shall taken from you (The Jews), and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall broken: but whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.” (Matt.21:42-44)

Jesus (S) spoke of people  like you: Not everyone will recognize the kingdom of God. 

Matthew13:10-17

·       10And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?

·       11He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

·       12For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

·       13Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

·       14And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:

·       15For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

 The people who will understand are the ones who see, hear and understand with his “heart”.

·       16But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear not.

·       17For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.  

·       And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel (Good News of the Kingdom of God) to every creature. Mark 16:15 (the coming of the everlasting Good News: The Qur’an)

Allah (S) said:

·       We have not sent thee but as a (universal Messenger) to all mankind…but most of mankind know not. (Q.34:28)

·       Truth has (now) come, and falsehood perished: for falsehood is (by its nature) bound to perish. (Q.17:81)

·       ye People of the Book! Believe in what We have (now) revealed, conforming what was (already) with you… (Q.4: 47)

·       None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar: knowest thou not Allah hath power over all things?  (Q.2:106)

From those, too, who called themselves Christians We did take a Covenant, But they forgot a good part of the message that was sent down: So We stirred up enmity and hatred between the one and the other, to the Day of Judgment. And soon will Allah show them what it is they have done. (Q.5:14)

Br. zainool



Edited by truthnowcome - 31 July 2013 at 9:23pm
LET'S SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL...NO MORE LIES!
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truthnowcome
 
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Quote truthnowcome Replybullet Posted: 31 July 2013 at 9:31pm
Originally posted by Caringheart

What is this something else...
I have to say what keeps sticking in my mind is the cruel way in which Muhammad condoned the killing of Umm Qirfa.  For me this is no man of God.
_________________

4 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. - 1 John

A quick copy and past will do the job:<>

THE DISCIPLES KNEW OF HIM! 

       It was conformed in 1John.4:1

“Beloved, believes not every spirit, but tries the spirits whether they are of god because many false prophets are gone out into the world.” 1John.4:1  

Now, let us look at this statement, “believe not every spirit”. How do we “believe”? We cannot believe if we do not listen and heard the spirit, correct? We have to listen and hear the spirit to believe. Now, the verse continues: “but try the spirits whether they are of God” How do we try the Spirit? By questioning him, and that is not my opinion, V.2 conforms it: “2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:”

The Spirit has to “confess” and if he “confesses” that would mean we have to listen to him. Now, let us go back to V.1 it says: “because many false prophets are gone out into the world.”

Why “gone out into the world”? Because, “into the world” you have to go and look! And what you have to look for? It says: “Because many false prophets are gone out.” The opposite of false prophet is what? True Prophet!!!

 Conclusion: John is saying, go out into the world and look for a true prophet with the true spirit. And how do we know him? V.2 Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God. The prophet with the true spirit will have to confess that Jesus (s) come in flesh.

 

CONFSSIONED OF THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH

To have a better understanding we have to begin with the book of john.

It is mentioned in John.1:1 “In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was god.”

 If the word “was” God and the word was “with” God in the literal sense, it would mean that there are two Gods! In the Biblical language, the term “god” is used metaphorically to indicate power. Paul referred to the DEVIL as god. 

In whom the “god” of this world hath blinded the mind of them which believe not... (2Corinthiants4:4)

  Moses (S) also referred to as god:

“and the lord said unto Moses, see I have made thee a ‘god’ to pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.” (Exodus 7:1)

 Which word was “with” God in the beginning? For us to know we have to go to the beginning.

It mentioned in the beginning:

“and God said, let there be light: and there was light”. (genesis.1:3)

   So which word was with God? BE! And that is the word he used to create all things according Genesis 1

Quran puts it in short:

“When he (Allah) hath decreed a matter, He but said to it, be and it is!” (Q.3:47)   

The same word also He used to create the life:

 (Brackets added in verse)

...and the life was the light of men, and the light shineth in darkness (man) and the darkness (man) comprehended it not”. (John.1:4-5) that was the true light, which lightest every man that come into this world. (John.1:9).

The “TRUE LIGHT” was the “LIFE” that was created with the word “BE”. We have to read the messages in context to have the correct meaning. Jesus (S) got the title as the “WORD” because he was created from the word which was “BE”. Qur’an tells us:

“The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, BE And he was.” (Q.3:59)

and the word (be) was made flesh, and dwell among us. (john.1:14)

 How the word “BE” was made flesh? The Qur’an gives the answer:

Behold! The angel said: o Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a word from him: his name will be (Isa) Christ Jesus, the son of Mary...she said: "o my lord! how shall i have a son when no man hath touched me?" Allah createth what he willeth: when he hath decreed a matter, he but saith to it be, and it is! (Q.3:45-47) 

   And the word “BE” was made flesh and dwell among us.

And John tells us:

Here by know ye the spirit of god: every spirit that comfesseth that Jesus Christ is come in flesh is of god. (1John 4:2)

Who confesses that? Muhammad (S), He (S) was that True Prophet with the Spirit of Truth!

Allah (S) mentioned in the Qur’an:

“Verily this is a revelation from the Lord of the world:

With it came down the SPIRIT OF FAITH and TRUTH (Rooh-ul-Amin).

To thy heart.” (Q.26:192-194)

He shall testify of me! Jesus (s) said:

“when the comforter is come, whom i will send unto you from the father, even the spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the father, he will testify of me.” (John 15:26 ) 

 The Noble Reminder to the people of the book: Allah (S) mentioned in the Qur'an:

“O people of book! commit no excess in your religion: nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) a messenger of Allah and his word (be), which he bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His messenger. Say not "trinity": desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one God: glory be to Him. (Q.4:171)    

Jesus was a MESSENGER of Allah, a WORD from Allah and a SPIRIT proceeding from Allah.   “...He shall testify of me.” (John 15:26)

The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, BE And he was. (Q.3:59)

 The truth [comes] from thy Lord alone; so be not of those who doubt. (Q.3:60)

Allah (S) said:

"If any one disputes in this matter with thee, now after [full] knowledge hath come to thee, Say: 'Come! Let us gather together, our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves: Then let us earnestly pray. And invoke the curse of Allah on those who lie!'" (Q.3:61)

Br. zainool

LET'S SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL...NO MORE LIES!
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Caringheart
 
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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 27 August 2013 at 10:08am
I don't believe allah, is my God
because with allah there is no love
allah does not teach love to one another, and forgiveness to one another
the only love or forgiveness the quran talks about is that allah is loving, and allah is forgiving
it tries to convince you of this
but if allah does not teach to love all people, and to forgive all people, then he is not my God.
To love requires free-will
Does allah give free will?
Does he allow each one to love him freely, in the unique way in which they were created?  Does he allow love with the heart? 
Or does he demand ritual?
Yahshua spoke against the Pharisees because of their empty rituals.

But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.  3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

Does a slave love his master because he does as he is told to do?  No, a slave only loves his master when he feels free to do, or not to do.  It is in his freedom that he loves.  When a master gives him freedom, then it is, that he may truly love.  If first, the master demonstrates love, then it is, that he may also receive love in return, but no one can demand love.  Love may only be given, may only be asked for, in freedom.

36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

38 This is the first and great commandment.

39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.


19 We love him, because he first loved us.


12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.


20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

21 And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also.



Edited by Caringheart - 28 August 2013 at 10:17am
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
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NABA
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Quote NABA Replybullet Posted: 28 August 2013 at 12:34pm
Allah says in ch 41 v 34-no doubt good deed can't b equal to bad deed, in response to bad deed do a good deed n u will c that the enemy will become ur best friend, Allah says in ch 6 v 160-for 1 good deed u wil get reward equal to 10 deeds, for 1bad deed only 1 will b recorded or will b forgiven if we ask for forgiveness!!!! This shows how Allah is merciful.will this change ur view now caringheart????
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