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JohnDM
 
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bullet Topic: Quran - 19: Magic Number
    Posted: 25 March 2005 at 10:56am
Cn anyone please explain why the number 19 or multiples of the number
19 are used to form and fashion the Quaran?

Thanks
"Ignorance is no refuge"
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MOCKBA
 
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bullet Posted: 25 March 2005 at 6:41pm

 

The number of 19 or multiples of the number of 19 are NOT used to form and fashion the Qur'aan.

There are some deviant groups emphasizing on "mathematical miracles" of the Qur'aan (something like "if you add this and subtract the sum of thats dividing it into half and look at the resulting number's reflection in the mirror... you'll be amazed at how truly miraculous Qur'aan is", or "if you look at the frequency at which this word is repeated and occurrence of its antonym and make their total - you will have 365, which equals the number of days in a year..."). 

That's mere rubbish, and such theories are not anywhere close to the main message and purpose of the Qur'aan... which is not in numbers. Don't waste time on them.

MOCKBA

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Suleyman
 
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bullet Posted: 26 March 2005 at 12:10am
Originally posted by MOCKBA

 

The number of 19 or multiples of the number of 19 are NOT used to form and fashion the Qur'aan.

There are some deviant groups emphasizing on "mathematical miracles" of the Qur'aan (something like "if you add this and subtract the sum of thats dividing it into half and look at the resulting number's reflection in the mirror... you'll be amazed at how truly miraculous Qur'aan is", or "if you look at the frequency at which this word is repeated and occurrence of its antonym and make their total - you will have 365, which equals the number of days in a year..."). 

That's mere rubbish, and such theories are not anywhere close to the main message and purpose of the Qur'aan... which is not in numbers. Don't waste time on them.

MOCKBA

Es_Selam'un Aleykum ve Rahmetullahi ve Berakatuh Brother Mockba,

Brother,these groups are so far away from Islam that when you ask them about the ayat numbers of the Qur'an adding this to the question:" in which school you have taken the numbers from?";then they look into your eyes like a sheep.They don't know the numbers of the ayats change school to school...as you know, some ayat numbers are different in Kufa School and some others are different in Madina School;then how they can find the connection between each other...Wa Salaam.

*After reading these explanations;i wish someone will not come and ask this;What!!,is the holy  Qur'an absent in some schools??...NO,i am talking about categorizing the ayats with numbers,in all of these schools,the total ayats are same;but giving the numbers to them is including a difference view with their serious signs which also includes barakah that at least shames the 19 provocators,proves their ignorance..

 



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JohnDM
 
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bullet Posted: 26 March 2005 at 2:00am
Mere rubbish?

OK, on reading your comment I thought about the measurements of the
holy rock, the most bloody sacred rock in the world, the place where
rivers of animal blood has been poured since Abraham tried to shed the
blood of his son Isaac (in about the year 1836BC), namely the rock in the
Dome of Rock, the Islamic shrine, Jerusalem.

The maximum length of the rock is 57 feet x a maximum width of 43
feet, hence the length is thrice 19.

Now on the BBC radio yesterday they had a person explain why he now
knew the date of the crucifixion was Good Friday, April 7th AD30. For he
said no other lunar date could be offered up.

Assuming you can appreciate this Christian argument, the counting from
say when Jesus was being 'crowned' with thorns by the Roman soldiers at
about 2:13am Friday, morning, some 7 hours before the process of
crucifixion took place, it is 592.273537 years until 12:00am July 16th
AD622 and the commencement of Islam's holy calendar.

Now the would-be Devil's own reference number is 'female' at 508.

And the reference number and area for the Stars and Stripes is 6840
square units at 114 x 60 and equivalent to 57 x 120, times or 190 x 36.
So the US flag is that of the Assassins.

Curiously, the height of the North Tower of the World Trade Center was
1,368 feet or twice 684, and 684 is not only the reference number for the
Stars and Stripes but the great Ancient Egyptian Osiris, the god, King and
Judge of the dead. For 684 is made up of an elohim a mighty angel at 323
(17 x 19) + 361 (19 x 19).

So now to 43 of the sacred rock at 57 x 43 feet. And the number 430 x
4,300 is twice 924,500 square feet, that is the area covering the four
triangular sides of the Great Pyramid.

And the volume of the Great Pyramid is 91,575,000 cubic feet and
reciprocated is 1.09200109200e-08. Thus the Great Pyramid also has the
reference number 109,200

And the Great Pyramid at 109,200 divided by the 27 Ancient Egyptian
gods depicted on the 28 finger width divisions of the A.E. cubit of
20.6120 inches, (Horus, the son of Osiris is shown twice) and square root
twice and multiplied by the Devil at 508,000 and divided by Osiris at 684
is 592.273537 years.

Thus counting backwards from the Islamic calendar, it is the mocking of
Jesus Christ as king of the Jews by the Roman soldiers soon after 2am
that Good Friday morning, namely April 7th AD30, and some 16 hours
before Passover. Thus, the Devil and Osiris were there so to speak in
Jerusalem, standing among the soldiers laughing at Jesus Christ.

Of course many believe not that such a thinh happened to Jesus, but still
the calculation for Good Friday being Good Friday and Passover still
stands.

I should add that I only did this calculation this morning having been
prompted by your comment.

Thanks

PS

And remember the most important thing for humans is TIME. For we are
under the control of TIME. And time is of Gravity, the 'grave' so to speak,
and the standard value for gravity throughout the Universe is 177,000
miles per second, but that another post.



"Ignorance is no refuge"
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Rehmat
 
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bullet Posted: 26 March 2005 at 7:30am

I should add that I only did this calculation this morning having been prompted by your comment.

 

That explain why your calculation is not much different than the ‘Did Six Million Die’ – Which is also not mention in Holy Qur’an , plus not divisable by 19.

 

Now coming to your calculation from that Zionist website answering-islam – “The first word (Ism) is mentioned in the Quran 19 times, 19x1.”

First word (I)sm in its original form, as it is used in bismillah (invocation), is mentioned 115 times in Holy Qur’an. Not divisible by 19.

 Instead, the Rabbi counted the other form of that word, and that is "Ism", or more correct "ASM". But he was not consistent even in this arbitrary counting, he further excluded all of its plural forms and all the forms with sufixxes (hu) and (hi) (what was not the case in other counts, for example when he counted all the forms of the words with root R- SH -D, when he wanted to prove his messengership)!

 

Are you sure about the ‘Good Friday’? Because several Christian scholars has proven that it was actually ‘Wednesday! Not Dr. Robber Funk, DDD, who after his six-year Bible study proved that 80% of its so-called ‘word of God’ was actually written by interested human (mostly Jews) to serve their wordily purposes!

 

Let us now see some of OT/NT calculations. For example, the world is 3,786 year old and Jesus could have 45 to 61 ‘genealogy’ to prophet Abraham!

 

OR what number 666 stands for? Pope, Anti-Christ or Henry Kissinger? Because according to ‘Biblical method of numbering’ they all add up to 666!

 

Have a good day!

Know your enemy!
No time to waste. Act now!
Tomorrow it will be too late
What You Don’t Know Can Kill You

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Suleyman
 
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bullet Posted: 26 March 2005 at 8:24am

Originally posted by JohnDM

Mere rubbish?

OK, on reading your comment I thought about the measurements of the
holy rock, the most bloody sacred rock in the world, the place where
rivers of animal blood has been poured since Abraham tried to shed the
blood of his son Isaac (in about the year 1836BC), namely the rock in the
Dome of Rock, the Islamic shrine, Jerusalem.

The maximum length of the rock is 57 feet x a maximum width of 43
feet, hence the length is thrice 19.

Now on the BBC radio yesterday they had a person explain why he now
knew the date of the crucifixion was Good Friday, April 7th AD30. For he
said no other lunar date could be offered up.

Assuming you can appreciate this Christian argument, the counting from
say when Jesus was being 'crowned' with thorns by the Roman soldiers at
about 2:13am Friday, morning, some 7 hours before the process of
crucifixion took place, it is 592.273537 years until 12:00am July 16th
AD622 and the commencement of Islam's holy calendar.

Now the would-be Devil's own reference number is 'female' at 508.

And the reference number and area for the Stars and Stripes is 6840
square units at 114 x 60 and equivalent to 57 x 120, times or 190 x 36.
So the US flag is that of the Assassins.

Curiously, the height of the North Tower of the World Trade Center was
1,368 feet or twice 684, and 684 is not only the reference number for the
Stars and Stripes but the great Ancient Egyptian Osiris, the god, King and
Judge of the dead. For 684 is made up of an elohim a mighty angel at 323
(17 x 19) + 361 (19 x 19).

So now to 43 of the sacred rock at 57 x 43 feet. And the number 430 x
4,300 is twice 924,500 square feet, that is the area covering the four
triangular sides of the Great Pyramid.

And the volume of the Great Pyramid is 91,575,000 cubic feet and
reciprocated is 1.09200109200e-08. Thus the Great Pyramid also has the
reference number 109,200

And the Great Pyramid at 109,200 divided by the 27 Ancient Egyptian
gods depicted on the 28 finger width divisions of the A.E. cubit of
20.6120 inches, (Horus, the son of Osiris is shown twice) and square root
twice and multiplied by the Devil at 508,000 and divided by Osiris at 684
is 592.273537 years.

Thus counting backwards from the Islamic calendar, it is the mocking of
Jesus Christ as king of the Jews by the Roman soldiers soon after 2am
that Good Friday morning, namely April 7th AD30, and some 16 hours
before Passover. Thus, the Devil and Osiris were there so to speak in
Jerusalem, standing among the soldiers laughing at Jesus Christ.

Of course many believe not that such a thinh happened to Jesus, but still
the calculation for Good Friday being Good Friday and Passover still
stands.

I should add that I only did this calculation this morning having been
prompted by your comment.

Thanks

PS

And remember the most important thing for humans is TIME. For we are
under the control of TIME. And time is of Gravity, the 'grave' so to speak,
and the standard value for gravity throughout the Universe is 177,000
miles per second, but that another post.



 If you will mind your brain to the meaning of the holy Qur'an more than fixing the assumptions and the numbers who has no scientific backgrounds,this will be good for you.Of course,you have rights to conducting your words to the board;but if you put mere rubbish words into the dialog then you come across to a rock...

 The number 19 in the holy Qur'an is one of the big exams came from Allah to the khafirs;also so many other exams are too.Let's look at to the ayats then i will give you some advice who is not mere rubbish!

 Take care these ayats:

Surah Muddaththir:

074.030
YUSUFALI: Over it are Nineteen. 

074.031
YUSUFALI: And We have set none but angels as Guardians of the Fire; and We have fixed their number only as a trial for Unbelievers,- in order that the People of the Book may arrive at certainty, and the Believers may increase in Faith,- and that no doubts may be left for the People of the Book and the Believers, and that those in whose hearts is a disease and the Unbelievers may say, "What symbol doth Allah intend by this?" Thus doth Allah leave to stray whom He pleaseth, and guide whom He pleaseth: and none can know the forces of thy Lord, except He and this is no other than a warning to mankind.

 As you have seen from the ayats;making wrong comments on the numbers will cause some serious problems.If i were you,i could not play with the Qur'an before understanding it's background and it's aim to Tawhid...there are more explanations about the issue;but leaving them for your insight on the issue will be more good than covering your four side...please read and think on the ayat again,really a big exam and warning us inside making wrong comments on the ayats.Of course these ayats have also more background inside their explanations;but take the one you belong to,don't bring on to the way you don't know...Wa Salaam... 

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A-Tirawi
 
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bullet Posted: 26 March 2005 at 9:20am
Originally posted by MOCKBA

 

The number of 19 or multiples of the number of 19 are NOT used to form and fashion the Qur'aan.

There are some deviant groups emphasizing on "mathematical miracles" of the Qur'aan (something like "if you add this and subtract the sum of thats dividing it into half and look at the resulting number's reflection in the mirror... you'll be amazed at how truly miraculous Qur'aan is", or "if you look at the frequency at which this word is repeated and occurrence of its antonym and make their total - you will have 365, which equals the number of days in a year..."). 

That's mere rubbish, and such theories are not anywhere close to the main message and purpose of the Qur'aan... which is not in numbers. Don't waste time on them.

MOCKBA

Mokba

in your response you called these people deviants that look to spend there time understanding the Qurans Miracle. These mathimatical perfection are very important, imho, in showing that Quran is not merely a book of no contradictions and life lessons.  Its the PERFECT BOOK written by the PERFECT.  And so how do we measure this?  Well we do this with what is the only thing that is perfect in this world -- mathamatics.  This is a language that is totally universal and unchanged.  1+1 can nver =3 

I have to admit, there r probably some scam artists out there, but the one i know to be true to his words and a scholar in every sense of the word is Imam Dr. Tariq Al Sweidan. 

Here is a link for you to check out on it!

http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywood/Park/6443/MIQ/stat.ht ml

I hope u find it to be enlightening

 

 

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Nausheen
 
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bullet Posted: 26 March 2005 at 10:14am

Auzubillahi minash shaitan ir rajeem,

Bismillah ir rahman ir rahim,

Originally posted by A-Tirawi

  And so how do we measure this?  Well we do this with what is the only thing that is perfect in this world -- mathamatics.  

Assalamualaikum wa rahmatullah,

Quran is the speech of Allah, the mercy of Allah, the wisdom of Allah.

This was given to the creation to understand and reflect. Much of how one is supposed to understand the Quran had been taught by the Prophet (SAW) himself, who was sent as an exempler of this book.

In a Hadith Aisha (RAA)reported that his(SAW) entire character was the Quran.

We as muslims should make Quran our character, our guide, our means to grow close to Allah subhan wa ta'ala.

Can anyone say with certainity that deducing the meaning of number 19 will be of any consequence in the hereafter?

Busy yourself for the hereafter, and leave that which does not concern you (your religion) ... this was the essence of the teachings of the Prophet (SAW). Then why is it that we are still busy in fancy curiosities that will not benefit us in the next life?

59:21 Had We sent down this Qur'an on a mountain, verily, thou wouldst have seen it humble itself and cleave asunder for fear of Allah. Such are the similitudes which We propound to men, that they may reflect.

Maa salaama,

Nausheen

 

Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa
Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena
wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.
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