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Islam for non-Muslims
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blond
 
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Quote blond Replybullet Posted: 01 April 2005 at 7:42am
Originally posted by tawhid

[QUOTE=unity1]
aalaikum salem

blessings in Christ my lord

where does islam stand in the debate of chreation and evolution?

where are the real enjeels?

sukran.

tawhid

 

W.A.S.

I have read that Darwinism was funded by Zionists.

You may want to research the Chaldean Councils of Nicea, where rabbinical scholars literally made up (frabicated) the myth of the Trinity. According to historical documents, it was there that they decided which books to include in the first Greek Septuigent "version" of the Bible, which books to leave out, and which parts of the remaining books to alter.

I would go into where you can find the Original "Lost Books", but it may be too hard to accept and I don't want to spark any debates on that subject.

Thank you.



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AhmadJoyia
 
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Quote AhmadJoyia Replybullet Posted: 01 April 2005 at 7:44am

Originally posted by Laurie

As in the Catholic Faith believers are made by God to attend Mass on Sunday or commit a mortal sin.  I f the believer then dies in this state of sin he is punished in hell!  As with the Islamic faith believers are made to pray 5 times a day at specific times in adoration of God.  My question is thus:  It may be quite niave but if God can create us, humans of such mental & physical complexity and as well the Universe in its entirety to enable us to survive, why then he is so insecure as to to make us pray and adore him under the threat of punishment on judgement day and into eternity.  I thought that is why God gave us free will otherwise we would be just religious robots. 

I think, the answer to your question is related to the purpose of human beings on this earth. You must have heard the story of prophet adam and eve and their disobeidence to Allah's command on the seduction of satan. It is almost the same in Christianity as well in Islam uptill this point but not any more in the details after wards. So let me continue the Islamic version of it (Kindly let me know if you need its reference from Quran as I don't exactly remember the verse # etc at this moment; but surely can look up to it if needed). We believe that adam and eve were not sent on earth as a punishment for their sin but they were predestined for this place right from the very begining of human creation. Humans are all made of clay that belongs to this place (earth). However, when satan made his point to show Allah as how the humans are potentially liable in disobeying Him, Allah told both humans and the satan to go down to earth for a particular and limited time (before the day of judgement). He also told them that those who would follow His commands shall be blessed and rewarded after the day of judgement. But those who would continue to follow satan and would become one of his accomplices, shall be punished for their disobeidence. This is why the day is call the "day of judgement", when every human is accountable for his own deeds. Good or bad, he has to face the day and get reward/punishment for all his actions that he did on this earth while alive. I want to make this further clear, that both, adam and eve, repented for their sin and Allah forgives anyone who repent. So, in a true sense, this life of ours is a test, like we are in an examination center. The satan is continuing in his evil deeds especially to divert humans from obeying Allah, however, Allah has sent the prophets as guides and reminders to humans to serve Him and Him alone. Thus, all our prayers and rituals to please Allah are for our own benefit only. Of course, Allah doesn't need them but he does promise good rewards for those who remain obeident to Him and punishment for those who disobey Him in this life and Allah never breaks His promise. Hopefully this makes sense to do good deeds and remember Allah continueously till our life time is over (time's up guys, hand over the paper). Rest Allah knows the best. cheers!

 

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AhmadJoyia
 
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Quote AhmadJoyia Replybullet Posted: 01 April 2005 at 8:29am
Originally posted by tawhid

Originally posted by unity1


Asalam Aalaikum

I welcome all my non-muslim friends in this forum who are interested in Islam. If you have any question regarding Islam ,then please donot hesitate to ask them here ,inshallah we will attempt to answer your question promptly.

Regards,

aalaikum salem

blessings in Christ my lord

where does islam stand in the debate of chreation and evolution?

where are the real enjeels?

sukran.

tawhid

 

My friend, as I understand it with my limited knowledge of Islam, there is really no debate (as its not an issue) in Islam over "Evolution and creation". Both are adjoint circumstances and can be true simultaneouly. This doesn't mean I am approving the evolution theory. There are lot of things in this world that Allah has not revealed to us in any form, however, do ask us to explore; explore through the knowledge and wisdom He has given us. The things we know for certain, what He has told us in Quran, is that Allah created first human being named, Adam, and sent him down to this earth along with his partner Eve. This could be the evloutionary form of any preexisting species on earth; I can't rule out this possiblity as Allah has not told us anything about it in Quran (at least, I have not heard anything about it before).  How adam and eve came to this earth, is also not told in specifics in Quran, however, one may attempt to guess it and that would always remain challangeable to other's views and logics. We also know that Allah had created universe and the earth (complete system of life) before sending Adam and eve into this system. So one can make out, again guess, that other animals could be the prior habitats of this earth, therefore, evolution of life may not necessarily begins with Adam. I think, the same stance can also be taken from the Christians or jews perspective, but the problem enters when their scrad books start counting time in a definitive way to reach not only to the geneology of adam but far beyond when God created this world etc. It is in this perspective that modern day science starts questioning the information based on biblical accounts. My disclaimer: This is totally my personal thought and I don't claim to be an expert on any thing. Rest Allah knows the best. Cheers!

 

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Shams Zaman
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Quote Shams Zaman Replybullet Posted: 06 April 2005 at 11:42am

My Dear Muslim and Non-Muslim brothers and Sisters! 

Be peace on you all, As Salam o Alikum!

 

We today are living in the world of logic and rationale. Yet, unfortunately we must have ignored a few basic and most important questions regarding our lives. Like:

(1)   What is the purpose of our life?

(2)   If we all have the same purpose then why we are divided in different religions?

(3)   If this worldly life is everything then why there is life and death?

(4)   Who is the creator of this Universe and what does he want from us?

(5)   Which is the true religion and what is thy logic?

 

Let us try to find the answers to these questions and I invite you all to explore them as well.

PURPOSE OF CREATION:   To exactly find the answer to this question we will have to go back to the origin of Human life. Science estimates that human life came to existence about 400,000 years ago while it claims to have discovered the earliest fossils of 40000 years old human.

While the Old Testament or the Torah says life is 10000 years old. So when Torah said this, it’s been almost another 3000 years. This adds the total to 13000 years. I would agree to this and am also of the opinion that the human civilization is not older than 15000 years, and now it is about to complete its age.

Before the Human civilization on earth the Jinns (creation of Fire) used to live. But and once they had turned this earth into hell due to chaos, bloodshed and wars, Allah ordered the angels along with some righteous Jinns to destroy their civilization. Lucifer whom we today call as the devil or the Satan was among the most pious Jinns.

He with his sincerity and dedication earned a very respectable place in heavens and became the head of all the righteous Jinns. Soon he became conceit and proud of himself. Allah who knows even the thoughts in our hearts not only disliked it but also put Lucifer to the test. Allah announced that He is creating a being as his deputy on earth out of clay. So once Allah had created Adam (though without soul) He provided Satan with full opportunity to see and judge the Adam. So once Satan was sure of it that the new creation (of clay) is inferior to him he was satisfied.

Now Allah ordered all angels and Jinns in heaven to bow in front of Adam after He had spelled His sprit in it. Upon this the Lucifer refused to bow on the false pretext of his superiority and creation from fire. He had failed the test.

Allah ordered him to leave the heavens as disgraced and rejected. At this point rather to repent for his arrogance Satan challenged Allah that Adam or the Human civilization is not worthy enough to be given the status of “Deputy (Caliph of Allah).”

The incident is covered in detail at almost six places in Quran. These are:         Sura Baqra-2, verse 30-40,    Sura Araaf-7, verse 11-30,    Sura Bani Israel-17, verse 61-67,    Sura Saad-38, verse 71-85,    Sura Hijar-15, verse 28-43,   Sura Kahaf-18, verse-50,      Sura Taha-20, verse 115-123.

At this point Satan also challenged Allah that he can prove that Human kind is not worthy of the honour which Allah has bestowed upon. So he asked Allah to give him time so as to prove his claim, which Allah granted him.

Now look at his words, in which he challenges, “He (Lucifer) said: As Thou hast caused me to go astray (by putting me to test), I will certainly lie in wait for them in Thy straight path o Then I will certainly come to them from front and from behind and from their right-hand side and from their left-hand side; and Thou shalt not find most of them thankful o” (Sura Araaf-7, verse 16-17).

“He (Lucifer) said: See for thyself: Is this the one whom Thou have honored over me? If Thou grant respite me to the day of resurrection, I will most certainly obliterate (and cast astray) its complete civilization except for very few o” (Sura Bani Israel-17, verse-62).

Adam and eve were then sent to heaven but they were told to stay away from a tree as a test. Satan beguiled them and they disobeyed the commandment of Allah. This event was merely a reminder for rest of the man kind that should not act on the advice of Satan and must not believe in his promises as his only aim is to cast you off the righteous track. That’s the reason we find this incident common to all the three divine religions, Judaism, Christianity and Islam. So we all acknowledge that Satan is our sole enemy.

Thus Brothers and Sisters we have been sent in this world for a test and the result would be simple, those who fail will be rewarded in hell and the successful will soothe in the heavens. The path has been laid down for us now the choice is ours. And anyone who thinks that we will earn a place in heaven without any worship and hardship he has actually fallen in the trap laid down by the Satan. You can’t fetch good grade or position in any exam without extreme hard work and neither can you stay in job without working for full hours.

So how can you expect to land in heaven without any worship or hardship. But majority of humans including Muslims as well have fallen in this trap. So merely believing in Muhammad, Jesus or Moses (May peace be on them all) will not fetch you the salvation.

 

DIFFERENT RELIGIONS:      All human were created from one seed, Adam and Eve. So initially there was one religion and that was to worship one God. Later Satan lured humans off the right path and they started worshiping the seen and distant things like moon, sun, star, idols etc.

Every time humans would go astray, Allah selected His messenger to guide them to the right path and gave them divine revelations. Each time this happened, and time and again Satan would cast them away by motivating them to make alterations in the Holy Scriptures. This continued on till ages until Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) came in this world. But this time Allah Almighty announced that Muhammad is the last messenger and Quran is the last revelation and from now on no messenger will be sent forth.

However what unusual happened this time was that Allah pronounced that no one will have the power or authority to make any alterations in the last revelation “Quran” till the end of this world. So anyone who is interested to find the truth, he can consult it from the Last Testament (Quran). But the struggle between the good and evil continued and is to last till the doomsday.

Now one important question arises here that why all the alliances had to come in existence against Islam or Muslims. Whether it be Balkans, or Chechnya, Kashmir or Palestine, Sudan or Libya, Iraq or Afghanistan. All forces are acting for one purpose alone, ‘TO TARGET ISLAM’. They can’t see a state with Islamic ideology but only with a secular identity. While Islam has no trouble to see the Western style democracy as a form of government. We can see for ourselves as to how multi-religious nations have formed an alliance against Muslims before the coming of anti-Christ or Dajjal (as we call him).

There can only be two possibilities that either all other religions are wrong and Islam is right or either Islam is wrong and all other religions are right.

Surely Hinduism, Buddhism, Judaism, Christianity and all other religions have altogether contrast teachings and one can easily conclude that who are obeying Allah and who are following Lucifer. And to find out which is the true religion we will have to consult the religious scriptures. And only Quran is in its original form.

If Judaism says that we are the chosen people and whatsoever we do to the Gentiles or Goyims we will not be asked in the hereafter. Well this is an unjust claim and must be rejected as folly of Satan. And if we can’t become Jew then why were we created we never wanted to be treated as animals or live like a third grade citizen? Then is the god of Jews unjust? But the Real and One God is not, and cannot be unjust. So again this is trap of Satan.

If Christianity says that only believing in Jesus (as Son of god) will take you to heaven then Jesus should have been the first one to descent from heavens and all messengers should have delivered the same message. And if he is the son then where is the mother? What about other children? Did god had only one son in ages and why not more? Is this possible that god is one as well as three at the same time? Which is this math by the way 1+1+1=1?

So there is one religion for all to believe in one God and to submit to his commandments since the Prophet Adam. What else exists is the distorted picture of true religion at the hands of Lucifer.

 

IF THIS IS THE ONLY LIFE THEN WHAT LIFE AND DEATH MEANS?     Some people would say that this is the only life and there is nothing in the hereafter. Well then who sends us in this world and where do we go after death?

What comes in us and what go out of us and who controls it?

Why to adhere to ethics and morality them?

The only purpose then should be survival, earn fame, money and good position in the society?

Why the nature is unjust as one is born limbless, blind or poor while other is rich?

We don’t see any loophole in nature then why this injustice in humans?

If one manages to escape justice in his life even after killing hundreds, collecting money through drugs etc then where to seek for justice?

Unfortunately most Muslims have also fallen in the trap set by Lucifer. Most think that Prophet Muhammad (MPBUH) will save them from hell even if they don’t perform the righteous deeds and by merely believing in Muhammad as the last messenger they get license to heaven. The concept seems to be inspired from that of Christians and Jews. Against the teachings of Islam they are divided into sects and everyone is confident that he has the license to heaven and most have indulged in the practice of Shrik (associating partners with Allah). Like some follow the distorted teachings of Sufism while praying to the dead, for some the personal whims and desires have sought top most preference, while others consider nationalism and secularism as superior to Allah and Islam.

So the non-Muslims should not worry, they certainly will find lot of Muslims also burning in the hell alongside them. Bearing Muslim names does not qualify a person for heaven.

Another question arises that is religion a personal affair. Definitely not, will someone insolently pass over his brother’s house on fire just commenting that “Its his personnel affair?” No, he would try to put off that fire. Similarly we must try to save our Muslim and non-Muslim brothers and sisters from entering the hellfire. They are not our enemy rather the Satan is who has mystified them. So please help them in finding the right path as we will be asked that whether we delivered the message or not?    

  

WHO IS CREATOR AND WHAT HE WANTS FROM US?      

Allah our creator and what He wants from us is clearly stated in His last and Final Revelations The Quran. However, in short He wants from us,

  1. Not to associate partners with Him.
  2. Worship Him alone.
  3. Believe in Angels, all His revelations and messengers.
  4. Believe in the Day of Judgment.
  5. Pray 5 times a day, fasting 30 days a month, pay Zakat (charity), perform Hajj once in life time.
  6. Do not kill any innocent, obey your parents, treat others gently and avoid intimate relationship with others except for your legitimate life partner.
  7.  Avoid social evils like adultery, stealing, drinking liquor, gambling etc.
  8.  Struggle for the creation of ideal and peaceful society on Islamic principles progressively using all available means (Preaching, Teaching, Education, Dialogue, Personal example and force if necessary, but not on others for conversion).

 

TRUE RELIGION AND LOGIC:

Why Islam is a true religion:

  1. It is in its purest form and safe from alteration.
  2. Its teachings are the same since Adam.
  3. It provides all the solutions to all existing issues.
  4. It has no contradictions in the divine revelations and is 100% compatible with modern and technology.
  5. It offers solutions as how to achieve the end state by creating an Islamic society.
  6. It offers unique and equal rights within the laid down framework for men, women and even animals. 
  7. It offers a direct contact with God (Allah Almighty) with no intermediates and channels.
  8. It makes sure that all previous divine revelations (Torah, Zaboor, Injeel etc) and all messengers of God should be accepted and believed in.

 

THE MESSAGE STANDS OUT CLEARLY CHOICE IS YOURS.           

Shams Zaman  Pakistan 

smszmn72@yahoo.com 

smszmn72@yahoo.cm
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Laurie
 
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Quote Laurie Replybullet Posted: 06 April 2005 at 10:31pm

A very long and tedious read Zaman and only convincing if first and foremost you believe that the person Mahammad did actually see Archangel Gabriel as he stated. 

No one else saw the Angel. So, if I was a non Muslim, reading this site and had difficulty with the manner in which Mahammad got his revelations than I would think you were, as they say, "preaching to the converted."  Other Religions base their faith on a divine messenger and his revelations as well as Islam, so, as I see it, you have to first convince me with very objective (not subjective) arguments, NOT DOGMA, that it is beyond question, that the Arcghangel Gabriel visitations did in fact happen and indeed it was God talking to him vide Gabriel. 

 And I do believe we could all learn a great deal about God, how to find God within, wholesome moral living, service and the life hereafter from the writings of the Mystic Sufis moreso than the Quran (My opinion only).

As you stated at the start that we "live in a world of logic and rationale" well the Mystic Sufis will give you God without all that logic and rationale.

What about free will? 

You sound like a very conscious and committed Muslim who is passionate about his Religion, adoration of God and service to the world community but as to converting me, your writings speak too heavily of Dogma, blind faith and eternal damnation with hellfire and brimstone. There have been many men and woman who have been divinely inspired statesmen/women who have changed the course of history for the betterment of all mankind you will have to convince me that Mahammad, although possibly the best, was any greater than them. How you do that I do not know.

Good luck to you Zaman and I wish you God's peace, grace and blessings throughout your liftetime of submission to God's will.

So God wills it. So be it. It is done.
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Quote Nausheen Replybullet Posted: 07 April 2005 at 5:56am
Originally posted by Laurie

A very long and tedious read Zaman and only convincing if first and foremost you believe that the person Mahammad did actually see Archangel Gabriel as he stated. 

No one else saw the Angel.

Sometimes the Angel came to him dressed like a man. Had long conversation with him in public, and he (muhammada sallallahualaihe wassallam) delacred his identity after he left.

Revelations did not come on him always in private. These were witnessed by many of the companions and his wife Ayesha (raa) on several occasions.

I am sorry for keeping it short .... will get back when I have more time

Peace,

Nausheen

Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa
Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena
wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.
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Quote Angel Replybullet Posted: 07 April 2005 at 9:10am
Originally posted by Nausheen

Originally posted by Laurie

A very long and tedious read Zaman and only convincing if first and foremost you believe that the person Mahammad did actually see Archangel Gabriel as he stated. 

No one else saw the Angel.

Sometimes the Angel came to him dressed like a man. Had long conversation with him in public, and he (muhammada sallallahualaihe wassallam) delacred his identity after he left.

Was Muhammed the only one that saw the Angel? or did others saw the Angel to?

~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
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Quote blond Replybullet Posted: 07 April 2005 at 9:59am
Originally posted by Angel

Originally posted by Nausheen

Originally posted by Laurie

A very long and tedious read Zaman and only convincing if first and foremost you believe that the person Mahammad did actually see Archangel Gabriel as he stated. 

No one else saw the Angel.

Sometimes the Angel came to him dressed like a man. Had long conversation with him in public, and he (muhammada sallallahualaihe wassallam) delacred his identity after he left.

Was Muhammed the only one that saw the Angel? or did others saw the Angel to?

Peace.

I believe that in this Hadith, the Prophet (pbuh) asked those present if they knew who that man (Jibril) was, after he (Jibril) departed.

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