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Message Icon Topic: The Holy Gospel did not evolve! Post Reply Post New Topic
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semar
 
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Quote semar Replybullet Posted: 11 April 2011 at 1:35am
Originally posted by Jack Catholic

Dear Semar, truthnowcome, and Mansoor_ali,

I have been a reporter for a newspaper before.  I know all about reporting news in a hurry before any other newspaper gets the information printed, and about putting the most important information in the first two paragraphs.  The concept of newspaper writing as you and I know it is only about 150 years old.  2000 years ago, there was not publishing of news papers, or television news teams.  The standard of news reporting in our day did not exist back then, and therefore does not apply.   Sorry...

Come on, this is not about reporting standard, but this is just pure human instinct, even our toddlers will tell us what the most exciting things that they have experienced with right away.  No wait for 70 years.

Edited by semar - 11 April 2011 at 1:48am
Salam/Peace,
Semar
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Quote truthnowcome Replybullet Posted: 12 April 2011 at 12:13am

Originally posted by Jack Catholic

Dear Semar, truthnowcome

As for the orriginal language of the disciples, it is well known that in Jerusalem were spoken Aramaic, Hebrew, and Greek. Jews living in communities outside of Israel spoke mainly Greek. What was written by the Apostles and disciples was written for all Jews and Christians everywhere, not just those residing in Israel. Jesus came for ALL Jews, Christians, and gentiles interested in Christianity. The best language to reach them all was Greek. Not many non-Muslims accept the language argument that you and many other Muslims keep asserting. We rather laugh at the imaginings that the language of the oldest manuscripts would be an issue for anyone today...

Well, God bless you all,

Jack Catholic

Peace my friend!

            Br. Jack, you don’t know the trick of the Devil, let me fill you in. The best way to pull a vial over someone is to remove them from their native language and used a language that you can manipulate them with.  

Example:  To greet someone Jesus (S) said: “Shalom laka” If I am correct I don’t able to go and look it up. Anyway, that is to say Peace unto you.

Had it be used by the Christians you would not failed to recognize the Muslim’s Greetings.

          Most importantly the word “Rab” Lord! It is wrongly translated as “Lord” for Jesus (S). The proof for that is in your bible. The Disciples were calling him Rab and the Jews never object to although they knew the word “Rab” mean Lord, why?  Because Jesus (S) was the Rabbai for his disciples!  Who said so? The original language: 16Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. John20:16

    The short form for master is Rab! The Devil changes the language and replaces Rab (master) to Rab (Lord) and the call Jesus (S) Lord instead of master. Nice trick ehh!

Had they used the original language you won’t fail to recognize the name of God “Allah”

         The language of Jesus (S): “Although Jesus spoke Aramaic, the Gospels are in Greek, and only rarely quote actual Aramaic words. Reconstruction of the Aramaic background of the Gospels remains a fascinating, but inordinately difficult area of modern research.” http://cal1.cn.huc.edu/aramaic_language.html

         If you go to Go to the Aramaic Lexicon and Concordance type the word “God” the name Allah will show up.   http://www.peshitta.org/cgi-bin/lexicon.cgi

       The point is if they had used the original language of Jesus (S) and preaches his message Christians won’t find it hard to swallow the name “Allah”; in other, which ever language you translate the writings in they should put the original at the side. But no, if they do that it would let the cat out of the bag earlier. So you see how original language is important!!

tnc



Edited by truthnowcome - 12 April 2011 at 12:18am
LET'S SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL...NO MORE LIES!
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Quote IssaEl999 Replybullet Posted: 12 April 2011 at 12:46am
Originally posted by truthnowcome

Originally posted by Jack Catholic

Dear Semar, truthnowcome

As for the orriginal language of the disciples, it is well known that in Jerusalem were spoken Aramaic, Hebrew, and Greek. Jews living in communities outside of Israel spoke mainly Greek. What was written by the Apostles and disciples was written for all Jews and Christians everywhere, not just those residing in Israel. Jesus came for ALL Jews, Christians, and gentiles interested in Christianity. The best language to reach them all was Greek. Not many non-Muslims accept the language argument that you and many other Muslims keep asserting. We rather laugh at the imaginings that the language of the oldest manuscripts would be an issue for anyone today...

Well, God bless you all,

Jack Catholic

Peace my friend!

            Br. Jack, you don’t know the trick of the Devil, let me fill you in. The best way to pull a vial over someone is to remove them from their native language and used a language that you can manipulate them with.  

Example:  To greet someone Jesus (S) said: “Shalom laka” If I am correct I don’t able to go and look it up. Anyway, that is to say Peace unto you.

Had it be used by the Christians you would not failed to recognize the Muslim’s Greetings.

          Most importantly the word “Rab” Lord! It is wrongly translated as “Lord” for Jesus (S). The proof for that is in your bible. The Disciples were calling him Rab and the Jews never object to although they knew the word “Rab” mean Lord, why?  Because Jesus (S) was the Rabbai for his disciples!  Who said so? The original language: 16Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. John20:16

    The short form for master is Rab! The Devil changes the language and replaces Rab (master) to Rab (Lord) and the call Jesus (S) Lord instead of master. Nice trick ehh!

Had they used the original language you won’t fail to recognize the name of God “Allah”

         The language of Jesus (S): “Although Jesus spoke Aramaic, the Gospels are in Greek, and only rarely quote actual Aramaic words. Reconstruction of the Aramaic background of the Gospels remains a fascinating, but inordinately difficult area of modern research.” http://cal1.cn.huc.edu/aramaic_language.html

         If you go to Go to the Aramaic Lexicon and Concordance type the word “God” the name Allah will show up.   http://www.peshitta.org/cgi-bin/lexicon.cgi

       The point is if they had used the original language of Jesus (S) and preaches his message Christians won’t find it hard to swallow the name “Allah”; in other, which ever language you translate the writings in they should put the original at the side. But no, if they do that it would let the cat out of the bag earlier. So you see how original language is important!!

tnc

 
 
I Have Been Trying To Tell A Few Here The Same Thing <So you see how original language is important!!> LOLLOL


Edited by IssaEl999 - 12 April 2011 at 12:48am
El's Holy Qur'aan , States In Chapter 17 ; 81 , '' And Say ; Truth Has ( Now ) Arrived , And Falsehood Perished ; For Falsehood Is ( By Its Nature ) Bound To Perish (81 ) .
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Quote Jack Catholic Replybullet Posted: 12 April 2011 at 4:33pm
Dear IssaEl999 and brothers,
 
I do not have a problem with anything you have posted.  Accept for one thing: Teacher, Master, and Lord are synonyms in English.  Calling Jesus Lord is not an incorrect translation when we are speaking about English.
 
About the name of, "Allah," for Yahweh (Jehovah), I am all for calling God, "Allah."  The problem here on Islamicity.com is that though Christians have been calling God, "Allah" for 2000+ years (longer than Islam has existed), yet Muslims have told me they are offended when I referr to God in a Christian way while calling Him, "Allah,"  they are highly offended.  What's more, in Muslim countries, Muslims are putting Christians to death in the streets for using this name in reference to the Christian God.  Then Christians are being accused of provoking these murders.  Many of these countries have made it national law forbidding Christians from calling God, "Allah," saying that because we recognize God as a trinity, calling God, "Allah," is blasphemy against the understanding the Muslims have of God.  I did not make this controversy, nor do I kill people over the issue.  But Muslims are killing Christians regularly over it.  What can I say?  I'd like to see Muslims police themselves on this issue, bringing other Muslims to justice for these murders.  But the Holy Qur'an does not recommend the death penalty for murder should a Muslim kill a Christian, thought it does recommend the death penalty for a Christian who kills a Muslim.  Go figure that one.
 
About your post, you haven't made a case for the Holy Bible evolving over time, as many Muslims seem to assert.  Can you show that it has evolved over time?  So far, nobody has done so. 
 
God Bless,
 
Jack Catholic
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Quote Jack Catholic Replybullet Posted: 15 April 2011 at 3:04pm

Dear Mansoor_ali,

I listened to the debates.  They were great!!!  Whose argument do you think prevailed? Why?

Dear IssaEl999,

You should read the story of David in the Jewish Old Testament.  You will see clearly that David was never crucified.  You will also see that the Christian New Testament does not claim that David WAS crucified.  What point were you trying to assert in your post?  

Also, the very old custom that comes from the Middle East and the Mediteranian world of men kissing each other is no act of homosexuality.  We must be careful not to use modern ocurances to interpret something that happened nearly 4000 years ago.  The ancient custom is that a kiss means a promiss and is a sign of great respect.  It is placed on another’s cheek, or on the forehead, or on the hand.  A kiss on the lips is reserved only for husband and wife.  David and Jonathan kissed each other on the cheek, perhaps on both cheeks.  I am surprised you do not know this...  There was no homosexuality in the lives of either David or Jonathan.  Perhaps a little extra study for you is in order.

Dear Semar,

You use toddlers to show how my comment about newspaper writing couldn’t possibly be true, but in your example of toddlers you have proven my point.  Toddlers don’t write for the local newspaper.  In fact, Christianity did not spread by way of the written word, but rather by the spoken word.  The bible was not composed in news paper form, but rather in story form.  Christians who shared the Good News that had changed their lives and inspired them undoubtedly told the important material first.  But in the Catholic Mass that formed the worship of the first century Christians, they shared not the newspaper version of Jesus’ message, but the story form of it.  And it was this form that was written down in the 4 Gospels of the Christian New Testament.  You are passing judgment on the writings of well trained and God-inspired men based on your modern and personal expectations.  Thus, you are missing the point that the original authors had in mind by writing their books.

Dear Truthcomenow,

You have not showed with the argument of Original Language that the message of the Holy Bible had been altered over time.  Try again...

IssaEl999, Mansoor_ali, Truthcomenow, and Semar,

Can you prove that the message of the Holy Bible evolved over time into something different from what Jesus actually taught, or not?  With over 210 views on this string, one must assume that many readers are waiting to see if you can?  For if you cannot, we must assume that the Holy Bible is accurate in its message and in reporting the facts of the life of Jesus...

God Bless,

Jack Catholic

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Quote semar Replybullet Posted: 15 April 2011 at 6:34pm
Dear Jack,
 
Spoken or written just a way of expression, its would follow the same instinct, so they would tell/write the most exciting thing. Not the other way around.
Salam/Peace,
Semar
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"1/3 of your stomach for food 1/3 for water, 1/3 for air"
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Quote Jack Catholic Replybullet Posted: 15 April 2011 at 10:05pm
Dear Semar,
 
You seem to try to discredit my explanation about why the 4 Gospels are written the way they are.  I know that I am right because the letters written by the bishops of the time of St. John the Apostle's last days began writing letters about the problems they were having in the care of the believers of thier time.  What I say is historically accurate as to why St. John wrote yet another account of the life of Jesus, and why it is so different from the previous three.
 
Yet when you say that the most important issues should have been written first, I cannot say that I blame you for saying it.  In fact, the reason why Christianity spread so quickly over the world is that people did precisely what you are saying they should have done.  Whenever a person came to a realization of who Jesus was and opened himself up to a personal relationship with Jesus (through prayer, obedience, study, and good works based upon almsgiving and fasting), he became filled with the Spirit of God.  He would become overwhelmed by that Holy Spirit in all aspects of his life, and many of the problems he had had with others, with family, and with life all around dissappeared.  Others might ask him about the joy he experienced even in the midst of suffering.  What is the reason for his joy, or the change in his life, others would ask.  At that moment, the person would share who he had just met, who Jesus really was, and what Jesus had done in his life to transform it.  I can attest to this even now as a modern Christian.  I know many Christians who can also.  There is no greater witness to the truth of the christian faith or of Jesus Christ in the Gospels than a changed life.  The bible was written to help us know Jesus and who he was.  It was written to help us know God the Father better, and to recognize and desire the Holy spirit to be present in our hearts and lives.  I offer praise and thanksgiving daily for all that God has done for me through Jesus Christ as a Catholic.  I hope and pray that one day you might be able to put asside some of the missunderstandings preached by Islam and come to know Allah as I know him.  Perhaps you might see life differently...  Who knows...
 
May God Bless you always,
 
Jack Catholic
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 16 April 2011 at 1:27pm
Originally posted by Jack Catholic

In the same way, the first Gospels of the Life of Jesus were written to communities that already knew that Jesus was the Son of God, and was in fact God Himself.  It was only some 70 years after the death of Jesus on the Cross that new Christians from throughout the world who had not known Jesus first hand were not getting the full story of Jesus and his message due to the full message not having been written down yet. Thus St. John the Apostle saw the need to write down what the first hand witnesses knew and took for granted that all believers in the first decades also knew. 
 
And yet neither Mark (generally considered to be chronologically the first gospel) nor John even mention the virgin birth, which I understand is central to Catholicism.  How could they have omitted it?  What's the point of writing a gospel, regardless of your audience, if you leave out the most important parts?
Addeenul ‘Aql – Religion is intellect.
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