IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum: IS MOHAMMED A DESCENDENT OF ISHMAEL?

Message

Originally posted by Meditations

Originally posted by JOUBERAR

The holiest book of Islam. Muslims consider the Qur’an as the infallible words of Allah, free of any ambiguities, contradictions, errors and irrationalities. This guide will demonstrate that far from being perfect, free of ambiguities and errors, the Qur’an is replete with hundreds of contradictory statements that will surprise the critical readers of the Qur’an. 

Dear JOUBERAR

Muslims scholars have practiced the laws of logic ( including what is the possible and impossible, what is contradiction ) for hunderds of years, this is not new to Islamic thinking 

you mentioned only 10 of what you consider contradictions, is there's more ? 
Also where are these errors you speak of ? 

My question to you, 
If we resolve these so called contradictions you come up with
Will you become a muslim and believer in Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) ?

Best Regards  

No I will not betray my God even if the Quran were flawless it doesn't mean it is the word of God.
The Torah is 3300 years old why would God deny all this and changed His mind and give us a new manuscrip which He himself self deny his own Son and His new govenant," God never changed".

Absurdities
There are other errors which are statements or stories which simply make no sense at all, and put into question the integrity of the writer or writers of the Qur'an. 
Man's Greatness
Sura 4:59 states,"Greater surely than the creation of man is the creation of the heavens and the earth; but most men know it not." This implies that greatness is only measured by size; that the mere vastness of the physical universe make it greater than man, an argument which would make a football of immensely greater value than the largest diamond. Our scripture tells us that Man's greatness lies not in his size, but in his relationship with God, that he is made in God's image, a claim which no other animate or inanimate object can make. 
 Seven Earths
Sura 65:12 reads, "It is God who hath created seven heavens and as many earths." We would love to know where the other six earths are. If these refer to the planets in our solar system, then they are short by two (and now possibly three). 

Jinns & Shooting stars:
Meteors, and even stars are said to be missiles fired at eavesdropping Satans and jinn who seek to listen to the reading of the Qur'an in heaven, and then pass on what they hear to men in suras 37:6-10; 55:33-35; 67:5; & 72:6-9. 
How are we to understand these suras? Can we believe indeed that Allah throws meteors, which are made up of carbon dioxide or iron-nickel, at non- material devils who steal a hearing at the heavenly council? And how do we explain the fact that many of earths meteors come in showers which consequently travel in parallel paths. Are we to thus understand that these parallel paths imply that the devils are all lined up in rows at the same moment? 
     Solomon's power over nature: 
a.     Birds and ants
King Solomon was taught the speech of birds (sura 27:16) and the speech of ants (sura 27:18-19). In his battles, he used birds extensively to drop clay bricks on Abrah's army (sura 105:3-4), and marched them in military parades (sura 27:17). He also used them to bring him messages of powerful queens (sura 27:20-27). 
Note: According to the historical record, Abrah's army was not defeated by bricks dropped on their head. Rather, they withdrew their attack on Mecca after smallpox broke out among the troops (Guillame, Islam, pgs.21ff). 
b.     Jinn
The Jinn were forced to work for Solomon, making him whatever he pleased, such as palaces, statues, large dishes, and brass fountains (sura 34:11-13). A malignant jinn was even commissioned to bring the Queen of Sheba's throne in the twinkling of an eye (sura 27:38-44). 
c.     Wind
The wind was subject to Solomon, travelling a month's journey both in the morning and in the evening (though the wisdom of its timing is somehow lost in translation) (sura 3:11; 21:81). 
d.     Ants talk
The ants, upon seeing Solomon and his army arriving in their valley (and by implication recognizing who he was), talk among themselves to flee underground so as not to be crushed (sura 27:18). 
Youth and dog sleep 309 years
Sura 18:9-25 tells the story of some youths (the exact number is debated) and a dog who sleep for 309 years with their eyes open and their ears closed (Note Yusuf Ali's attempts to delineate the exact time period of this story in footnote no.2365, and then concludes that it is merely a parable). 
The object of this story is to show Allah's power to keep those who trust in him, including the dog, without food or water for as long as he likes. 
 People become apes
In suras 2:65-66 and 7:163-167, Allah turns certain fishing people who break the Jewish sabbath into apes for their disobedience. Had Darwin read the Qur'an, his theory on evolution may have parallelled "Planet of the Apes" rather then the other way around. 

Author	Message
JOUBERAR Guest Group Joined: 13 March 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 573	Posted: 02 October 2009 at 10:59pm
	*Originally posted by Meditations* *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* The holiest book of Islam. Muslims consider the Qur’an as the infallible words of Allah, free of any ambiguities, contradictions, errors and irrationalities. This guide will demonstrate that far from being perfect, free of ambiguities and errors, the Qur’an is replete with hundreds of contradictory statements that will surprise the critical readers of the Qur’an. Dear JOUBERAR Muslims scholars have practiced the laws of logic ( including what is the possible and impossible, what is contradiction ) for hunderds of years, this is not new to Islamic thinking you mentioned only 10 of what you consider contradictions, is there's more ? Also where are these errors you speak of ? My question to you, If we resolve these so called contradictions you come up with Will you become a muslim and believer in Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) ? Best Regards No I will not betray my God even if the Quran were flawless it doesn't mean it is the word of God. The Torah is 3300 years old why would God deny all this and changed His mind and give us a new manuscrip which He himself self deny his own Son and His new govenant," God never changed". Absurdities There are other errors which are statements or stories which simply make no sense at all, and put into question the integrity of the writer or writers of the Qur'an. Man's Greatness Sura 4:59 states,"Greater surely than the creation of man is the creation of the heavens and the earth; but most men know it not." This implies that greatness is only measured by size; that the mere vastness of the physical universe make it greater than man, an argument which would make a football of immensely greater value than the largest diamond. Our scripture tells us that Man's greatness lies not in his size, but in his relationship with God, that he is made in God's image, a claim which no other animate or inanimate object can make. Seven Earths Sura 65:12 reads, "It is God who hath created seven heavens and as many earths." We would love to know where the other six earths are. If these refer to the planets in our solar system, then they are short by two (and now possibly three). Jinns & Shooting stars: Meteors, and even stars are said to be missiles fired at eavesdropping Satans and jinn who seek to listen to the reading of the Qur'an in heaven, and then pass on what they hear to men in suras 37:6-10; 55:33-35; 67:5; & 72:6-9. How are we to understand these suras? Can we believe indeed that Allah throws meteors, which are made up of carbon dioxide or iron-nickel, at non- material devils who steal a hearing at the heavenly council? And how do we explain the fact that many of earths meteors come in showers which consequently travel in parallel paths. Are we to thus understand that these parallel paths imply that the devils are all lined up in rows at the same moment? Solomon's power over nature: a. Birds and ants King Solomon was taught the speech of birds (sura 27:16) and the speech of ants (sura 27:18-19). In his battles, he used birds extensively to drop clay bricks on Abrah's army (sura 105:3-4), and marched them in military parades (sura 27:17). He also used them to bring him messages of powerful queens (sura 27:20-27). Note: According to the historical record, Abrah's army was not defeated by bricks dropped on their head. Rather, they withdrew their attack on Mecca after smallpox broke out among the troops (Guillame, Islam, pgs.21ff). b. Jinn The Jinn were forced to work for Solomon, making him whatever he pleased, such as palaces, statues, large dishes, and brass fountains (sura 34:11-13). A malignant jinn was even commissioned to bring the Queen of Sheba's throne in the twinkling of an eye (sura 27:38-44). c. Wind The wind was subject to Solomon, travelling a month's journey both in the morning and in the evening (though the wisdom of its timing is somehow lost in translation) (sura 3:11; 21:81). d. Ants talk The ants, upon seeing Solomon and his army arriving in their valley (and by implication recognizing who he was), talk among themselves to flee underground so as not to be crushed (sura 27:18). Youth and dog sleep 309 years Sura 18:9-25 tells the story of some youths (the exact number is debated) and a dog who sleep for 309 years with their eyes open and their ears closed (Note Yusuf Ali's attempts to delineate the exact time period of this story in footnote no.2365, and then concludes that it is merely a parable). The object of this story is to show Allah's power to keep those who trust in him, including the dog, without food or water for as long as he likes. People become apes In suras 2:65-66 and 7:163-167, Allah turns certain fishing people who break the Jewish sabbath into apes for their disobedience. Had Darwin read the Qur'an, his theory on evolution may have parallelled "Planet of the Apes" rather then the other way around.
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Meditations Senior Member Joined: 16 November 2002 Online Status: Offline Posts: 239	Posted: 06 October 2009 at 11:47am
	*Originally posted by JOUBERAR* No I will not betray my God even if the Quran were flawless it doesn't mean it is the word of God. It doesn't mean so, but if it's flawless, and contained information that no way prophet Muhammad ( PBUH ) was able to know it , how do you explain this ? *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* The Torah is 3300 years old why would God deny all this and changed His mind and give us a new manuscrip which He himself self deny his own Son and His new govenant," God never changed". The same logic can be said about the new testament ( unless you're jew and don't believe in it ) Why would God send something 1300 years after the Torah that negates some rulings in it ? like Sabbath, eating pigs ..etc. ?
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Meditations Senior Member Joined: 16 November 2002 Online Status: Offline Posts: 239	Posted: 07 October 2009 at 5:51am
	*Originally posted by JOUBERAR* This guide will demonstrate that far from being perfect, free of ambiguities and errors, the Qur’an is replete with hundreds of contradictory statements that will surprise the critical readers of the Qur’an. Dear JOUBERAR It seems that you're copying / pasting this from some source ( the guide you say ) because if you check these so called contradictions, you'll be very surprised *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:21Allah created the mankind; they should worship Him. Contradiction: 3:97, 35:15 say Allah does not need mankind and the jinns; He is free of all want. The verses you are referring to are : [2:21] O mankind! worship your Lord, Who hath created you and those before you, so that ye may ward off (evil). AND [3:97] In it are Signs Manifest; (for example), the Station of Abraham; whoever enters it attains security; Pilgrimage thereto is a duty men owe to Allah,- those who can afford the journey; but if any deny faith, Allah stands not in need of any of His creatures. [35:15] O mankind! Ye are the poor in your relation to Allah. And Allah! He is the Absolute, the Owner of Praise. So where is the contradiction when God asks mankind to worship, what's in that implies that God is in need of anything ? *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:29 Allah created the earth (first) then He perfected the seven firmaments (heavens); He has the perfect knowledge of all things. (This verse indicates that Allah started creation by creating earth, and then He made heaven into seven heavens. This is how building usually starts, with the lower floors first and then the top floors—ibn Kathir). Contradiction: 79:27‑30 says Allah created the heavens first. First of all : Are you talking about Qur'an or Ibn Kathir intrepretation ? No one said Ibn Kathir is not subject to errors or criticism, ( I'm not saying he has errors ), but if you claim the Qur'an has errors, you need to prove it from Qur'an verses, but from a human's understanding which can have errors That said, the verses you are referring to are : [2:29]He is the One who created for you all that is in the earth, then He directed Himself toward the heaven, so He fashioned it into seven heavens, He is the all knowing of all things [79:27] Are you ( human beings ) a more prodigious creation than the heavern ? He built it [79:28] He raised it's height and leveled it [79:29] And He darkened it's night and brought out it's morning light [79:30] And the earth, after this He spread The verses talks about the stages which creation of heaven and earth went through, which has been proved scientifically to be true If we read these verses carefully, you'll find out it doesn't necessarily imply that either earth or heaven was created first [2:29] says : "then He directed Himself toward the heaven" it doesn't say "then He created the heaven" which can imply that heaven existed before that otherwise [79:30] says : And the earth, after this He spread ( into an oval shape ) which also implies that the spreading could have occurred after building/raising levelling of the heaven Also If you had visited Ibn Kathir notes about this, you'd have found out that in arabic language, using 'then' doesn't imply following in action, it can imply following in the news about the action Example of this from arabic poetry : Say to that who ruled, then ruled his father then ruled before that his grandfather The word 'then' here means that he's telling the news about that who ruled, then the news about his father ...etc. It doesn't mean that the ruling of the son happened, then after it in time the ruling of the father *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:34All the angels bowed to Adam except Iblis. He was haughty and a disbeliever. Contradiction: 16:49 says every creature in the heavens and in earth prostrates to Allah. The verses are [2:34] Then behold, We said to the angels: "Bow down to Adam" and So they bowed down except Iblis: he refused and grew arrogant, And thus did he become of the disbelievers [16:49] For to God bows down all that is in the heavens, and all that is in the earth of every beast as do the angels and they do not grow arrogant. The second verse doesn't say every creature , it talks about beasts and angels, it doesn't include iblis, or other kinds of devils, who do not bow down to God willingly *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:35 Allah forbade Adam and his wife to approach the tree of knowledge. (Allah spoke directly to Adam—ibn Kathir.) Contradiction: 42:51 says Allah never speaks directly to a human; He speaks either from behind a veil or through a messenger. verse 42:51 doesn't say only what you're referring to, it says [42:51] It is not fitting for a man that God should speak to him except by revealation, or from behind a veil, or by the sending of a messenger to reveal, with God's permission, whatever He so wills: Indeed He is ever exalted, all wise. I checked Ibn Kathir, couldn't find what you're saying about speaking directly to Adam Did you check it directly, or just copying / pasting from another source? Moreover , the verse talks about life on earth, not about absolute direct talking, which can occur before men on earth, or during life on earth outside earth or in the life after *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:37 Adam learned the words of inspiration from Allah. Adam was the first Muslim. 2:37 says : Adam then received words from His Lord, thus He granted him repentance. For indeed it is He who is the All Relenting, the Merciful What's in it that says Adam was the first muslim ? *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Contradiction: 2:131 says Abraham was the first Muslim. 2:131 says : For when his Lord said to him ( Abraham ): Submit yourself. He said I willingly I submit to the Lord of the worlds What's in it that says Abraham was the first muslim ? *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Contradiction: 6:14 says Muhammad was the first Muslim. Since the above isn't true, then there's no contradiction Moreover, the verse says : ..... Say Indeed I have been commanded to be the foremost of those who have willingly submitted themselves to God ..... *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Contradiction: 7:143 says Moses was the first Muslim. It says first believer, not first muslim No one said first muslim except Prophet Muhammad ( PBUH ) There's a big distinction between the word muslim and the word believer in Qur'an , where every believer is a muslim, while the opposite is not necessarily true *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Contradiction: 26:51 says some Egyptians were the first Muslims. This verse says believers as well And they ( the egyptian magician ) are speaking about what they witnessed, of which they were the first believers in it *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:38 Allah ordered Adam and his wife to descend on earth and to preach on people whatever message they received from Allah. Contradiction: In verse 20:123, before sending Adam on earth, Allah told him humans on earth would be enemies of one another. Incorrect, the verse 20:123 says : He ( God ) said: Descend from it all of you together, each of you an enemy to the other .... If you read only 7 verses back and start reading from 116, you'll know the verse talks about human and satan being enemies to each other, not humans being enemies to each other *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* This means there were already people on earth when Adam descended on it. So Adam was not the first human created by Allah. There was already creatures on earth before Adam descended to earth *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:47 Allah blesses the Children of Israel more than other believers; He has preferred them above all beings. Contradiction: 3:33‑34 says Allah preferred Adam, Noah, the house of Abraham, and the house of Imran above all beings. 2:47 : O children of Israel, Recall My blessings with which I have blessed you, and that I had Indeed showed preference to you above the people of the world Their preference was over the people of their time, not absolute, Also, If you go to Ibn Kahtir which you referred to you several times, you'll this mentioned there as well *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:50 Allah parted the sea (Red sea); saved the Children of Israel (i.e., Moses’ people), and drowned Pharaoh in front of the eyes of the Children of Israel. Contradiction: 10:90 says Pharaoh submitted to Islam. Contradiction: 10:92 says Allah saved Pharaoh. The verses 10:90-92 says : [Pickthal 10:90] And We brought the Children of Israel across the sea, and Pharaoh with his hosts pursued them in rebellion and transgression, till, when the (fate of) drowning overtook him, he exclaimed: I believe that there is no Allah save Him in Whom the Children of Israel believe, and I am of those who surrender (unto Him). [10:91] What! Now! When hitherto thou hast rebelled and been of the wrong-doers? [10:92] But this day We save thee in thy body that thou mayest be a sign to those who come after thee!. but verily, many among mankind are heedless of Our Signs!" As it's clear from the verses :pharoan was following Moses ( PBUH ) and children of Israel, the sea was parted, they went through it, when pharoah tried to followed them , the sea turned to it's original form and drowned him When he was drowning and dying he said I believe in the God of Moses, so his body was saved as a sign for those who come after him It's worth noting that Ramsis the 2nd , who's believed to be the pharoah of Moses ( PBUH ) is still preserved untill our times is that mentioned in the bible ? *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:52 Despite their sins of idolatry, Allah forgave the people of Moses. Contradiction: 2:63 says Allah raised the Mount Sinai above the Children of Israel and threatened them to submit to Him. The verses are : [2:52] Even then We did forgive you; there was a chance for you to be grateful. [2:63] And (remember, O Children of Israel) when We made a covenant with you and caused the mount to tower above you, (saying): Hold fast that which We have given you, and remember that which is therein, that ye may ward off (evil). So where is the contradiction ? Who said the raising of the mountain sinai was after the forgiveness and not before it ? *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Contradiction: 7:152 says Allah punished them. This might have been true if the verse after it ( 7:153 ) didn't exist, which puts the exception for those who repent The verses are : [2:52] Even then We did forgive you; there was a chance for you to be grateful. [7:152] Those who took the calf (for worship) will indeed be overwhelmed with wrath from their Lord, and with shame in this life: thus do We recompense those who invent (falsehoods). But if you go to the next verse you'll see : [7:153] But those who do ill-deeds and afterward repent and believe - lo! for them, afterward, Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. and if you go few verses back, you'll see : [7:148] And the folk of Moses, after (he left them), chose a calf (for worship), (made) out of their ornaments, of saffron hue, which gave a lowing sound. Saw they not that it spake not unto them nor guided them to any way? They chose it, and became wrong-doers. [7:149] And when they repented and saw that they had gone astray, they said: If our Lord show not mercy to us and forgive us we shall certainly be of the losers. So it's obvious now that they repented after worshiping the calf, and so were forgiven, which is what verse 2:52 is talking about *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 2:259 Allah caused a man to sleep for a century, then raised him up, and questioned the man how long he thought had been in sleep (in this verse Allah is directly speaking with an ordinary person). Contradiction: 42:51 says Allah speaks only through a veil or through a messenger Verse 2:259 doesn't say anything about speaking directly, also he was not an ordinary person, he was a Prophet verse 42:51 doesn't say only what you're referring to, it says [42:51] It is not fitting for a man that God should speak to him except by revealation, or from behind a veil, or by the sending of a messenger to reveal, with God's permission, whatever He so wills: Indeed He is ever exalted, all wise. *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* *IF YOU WANT MORE OF THE SO CALLED HOLY BOOK'S UNSEEN CONTRADICTIONS I WILL GIVE TO YOU* . I would like to see any more that you have, provided these are real contradictions, or at least been revised and have correct references, not a copy / paste from other sources Also to stay on topic, please post this in a new topic, this topic is not about this issue *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* We might wonder how the creator and the sustainer of all things in the Heavens and on earth could construct such a platitude and slovenly written document As proved so far there're no 'logical' contradictions that can't be resolved, so please save your conclusion about God until you prove so *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Scripture very clearly affirms the law of contradiction. As mentioned before, it's nothing unique to what you call 'scriptures' it's been in the core of Islamic thinking since the early days of Islam *Originally posted by JOUBERAR* Certainly we who love truth ought to jealously guard against any suggestion that God's revelation is internally inconsistent. But more than that, we need to defend the law of contradiction itself, because this is a biblical principle, and it lies at the root of all truth. And what will you say if we provide inconsistencies within the bible, that contradicts the law of contradiction you speak of in an unresolved ways ? Regards
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Akhe Abdullah Male Islam Senior Member Joined: 19 November 2008 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 1252	Posted: 07 October 2009 at 3:45pm
	*Originally posted by JOUBERAR* 10:90 says Pharaoh submitted to Islam.<SPAN style="COLOR: #0066ff">Contradiction:</SPAN> 10:92 says Allah saved Pharaoh. Topics discussed in this Verse: [Children of Israel:deliverance from Pharaoh] [Moses:crosses the Red Sea] [Muslims] [Pharaoh:drowned] 10:90 (Y. Ali) We took the Children of Israel across the sea: Pharaoh and his hosts followed them in insolence and spite. At length, when overwhelmed with the flood, he said: "I believe that there is no god except Him Whom the Children of Israel believe in: I am of those who submit (to Allah in Islam)." There are plenty of Ayats that says when death approaches the non-believer then at that time they want to say they belive Topics discussed in this Verse: [Pharaoh:drowned] 10:92 (Asad) [Nay,] but today We shall save only thy body, [112] so that thou mayest be a [warning] sign unto those who will come after thee: for, behold, a good many people are heedless. Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 07 October 2009 at 7:36pm
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Akhe Abdullah Male Islam Senior Member Joined: 19 November 2008 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 1252	Posted: 07 October 2009 at 4:24pm
	*Originally posted by JOUBERAR* The Torah is 3300 years old why would God deny all this and changed His mind and give us a new manuscrip which He himself self deny his own Son and His new govenant," God never changed? Who says that God has changed.You cant belive for one minute that man has'nt played a part in changing the word of God in the Bible?Honest answer please. *Originally posted by Meditations* Dear JOUBERAR[COLOR="#>0000ff"]It seems that you're copying / pasting this from some source ( the guide you say ) [/QUOTE]This is true on another topic I was guilty of this remember matthew 8:12 Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 07 October 2009 at 4:25pm
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Akhe Abdullah Male Islam Senior Member Joined: 19 November 2008 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 1252	Posted: 07 October 2009 at 7:30pm
	AL-Qur'an 10:89-91(89)We led the Children of Israel across the sea.Fir'aun(Pharaoh)and his host pursued them with wickedness and oppression,until when drowning,he cried out:"I believe that there is none worthy of worship but He(Allah)in Whom the Children of Israel believe,and I am one of the Muslims.(90)In response,it was said to him:"Now you believe!But a little while before you were disobedient and one of the mischief-makers!(91)We shall save your body today,so that you may become a sign for the succeeding generations;indeed many among mankind are heedless of Our signs! Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 07 October 2009 at 7:30pm
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Akhe Abdullah Male Islam Senior Member Joined: 19 November 2008 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 1252	Posted: 07 October 2009 at 7:38pm
	AL-Qur'an 95:In fact,those against whom the Word of your Rabb has proved true,will not believe,even if every sign should cme to them,until they themselves see the painful punishment.]Jouberar can you ever admit when you are wrong? you know as much about the Quran as most of us do about the Bible Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 07 October 2009 at 7:57pm
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Shibboleth Guest Group Joined: 06 August 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 281	Posted: 08 October 2009 at 1:59pm
	Originally posted by JOUBERAR Even though if he was a descendant of Ismael it wont make him a prophet or if he was a descendant of Jewish origin that too wont make him a prophet MEDITATIONS Then you should ask the topic starter what's the point of the topic Why? To First establish whether Muhammad is a true prophet or not because God’s word warns people about false prophets. Muhammad fails the test of a true prophet according to Moses. Should we then believe in his words? Secondly, if shown to be a false prophet as Meditations so honestly asks “how could he contain information that Prophet Muhammad was able to know it? Very good question! If not from divine origin, where else can it be from? Our Prophet Moses tells us; Deut. 13:1-4: “In case a *prophet* or a dreamer of a dream arises in your midst and does give you a sign or a portent, and the sign or the portent *does come true* of which he spoke to you, saying, ‘*Let us walk after other gods,* whom you have not known, and let us serve them,’ *you must not listen to the words of that prophet or to the dreamer of that dream,* because Jehovah your God is testing you to know whether you are loving Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul. The temptations of Satan’s interjections - Sura 53:19-26; 17:73-75 At one time Mohammed compromised and said concerning the daughters of Allah in Sura 53:19 that "their intercession was to be hoped for." In other words, Mohammed said we should hope for the help of these three idols. Mohammed’s followers were amazed that he said this. Mohammed later changed and said Satan had deceived him. These verses were abrogated or taken out. Suras 13:39. Allah doth blot out or confirm what He pleaseth: with Him is the Mother of the Book. Deuteronomy 18:10-12 ¹⁰ There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, a practicer of magic or anyone who looks for omens or a sorcerer, ¹¹ or one who binds others with a spell or anyone who consults a spirit medium or a professional foreteller of events or anyone who inquires of the dead. ¹² For everybody doing these things is something detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable things Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you. There is only ONE true God with only ONE name (Hebrew;YHWH or Yahweh English; Jehovah) all the others are false gods. The Hindu religion alone has millions of gods. The Devil is a god and can deceive anyone. Psalms 83 وَيَعْلَمُوا أَنَّكَ اسْمُكَ يَهْوَهُ وَحْدَكَ، الْعَلِيُّ عَلَى كُلِّ الأَرْضِ. 18 That men may know that thou, whose name alone is JEHOVAH, art the most high over all the earth. God’s Word is the only Holy book that is flawless. But for argument sake if the sign or portent comes true (it CAN come true) we still would not listen because it’s not from the most high God Jehovah, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The question was also asked; “Why would God send something 1300 years after the Torah that negates some rulings in it ? like Sabbath, eating pigs ..etc. ? Do you know why the Israelites where giving the Law of Moses? You have to go to the ‘Book’ to get the answer. Consider two reasons. First, the Law was like a protective wall. (Ephesians 2:14) Its righteous statutes acted as a barrier between Jew and Gentile. Thus the Law helped to preserve the line of the Seed of promise. (Jesus) Thanks largely to such protection, the nation still existed when God’s due time arrived for the Messiah (Shiloh) to be born into the tribe of Judah. Second, the Law thoroughly demonstrated mankind’s need for a ransom. A perfect Law, it exposed the inability of sinful humans to adhere to it fully. It thus served “to make transgressions manifest, until the seed (Jesus) should arrive to whom the promise had been made.” (Galatians 3:19) By means of animal sacrifices, the Law offered provisional atonement for sins. But since, as Paul wrote, “it is not possible for the blood of bulls and of goats to take sins away,” these sacrifices only foreshadowed Christ’s ransom sacrifice. (Hebrews 10:1-4) For faithful Jews, then, that covenant became a “tutor leading to Christ.”—Galatians 3:24. The “Law Covenant” waaaay in advance prepared Israel or Jews for the ‘Anointed one of God’ Jesus Christ. When he appeared specifically at that time they were expecting him at that time because it was prophesized Honestly ask yourselves, why would Jesus birth, life, death and resurrection be different and unique compared to any other of God’s Prophet? In more than fifty verses in the Qur’an, it is recorded that Jesus was born without a father, performed miracles, even resurrected the dead. God caused Christ to die, raised him to life, and then lifted him up to Him.—Āl ‘Imrān [3]:55, NJD; Maryam [19]:33, NJD; where as Muhammad is still in the grave. So, to emphasize your question; “Why would God send something 1300 years after the Torah that negates some rulings in it ? To fulfill the ‘Law Covenant’ so they will come true, namely the restoration of PARADISE! Something you and I both believe in Matthew 5:17 «لاَ تَظُنُّوا أَنِّي جِئْتُ لأَنْقُضَ النَّامُوسَ أَوِ الأَنْبِيَاءَ. مَا جِئْتُ لأَنْقُضَ بَلْ لأُكَمِّلَ. 17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
	“If you doubt what we have revealed to you, ask those who have read the Scriptures before you.” (Sura 10, Yunis [Jonah], verse 94) & (Surah Al ‘Imran: 84-85)
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Interfaith Dialogue
IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Interfaith Dialogue

Topic: IS MOHAMMED A DESCENDENT OF ISHMAEL?( Topic Closed)
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