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Interfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Interfaith Dialogue
Message Icon Topic: Is the Bible Still the Word of God? Post Reply Post New Topic
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Caringheart
 
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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 25 January 2014 at 1:28pm
Originally posted by mutakallim

Neil.

Good! If we are all educated then we must respect our source of learning and specialty if available. What attracts me in the Qur'an is 2:2, "That is the Book; in it is guidance sure, without doubt to those who fear (Allah/God, Elohim, Jehovah)."
Quantum mechanics is not the same as Electrophoresis although they are studied  under 'Physics.' Muhammad told the Levites in Medina that they have their way to obey their Lord and he has his own way to obey the Lord. Let there be no fight or quarrels. I mentioned education for Europeans are assumed to be rational, free, intelligent and ever ready to reason and judge. But when it comes to obedience to the Creator they do not even believe that they gave a created! What you are encouraged to do by the followers of Muhammad is not what Muhammad encourages you to do. He claims that he is sent by the same One whom sent all Messengers and Prophets to mankind for their salvation. He brought the same message. If you differ in him then he is not responsible - Settle your score with the One who sent him to mankind.
Good! Your statement: Are these a product of illiteracy or greed and power-hungry rulers? Or what?- is true. We followers of Muhammad are exceedingly ignorant and arrogant. You jumped to 12th century without starting from the moment and day Sumayya ( a lady) and her husband were murdered by Abu Jahl and his cohorts. You do not see the justification of Muhammad defending his right after his expulsion from Makka. You do not see how he disallowed his brothers cousins and uncles to forfeit their property after the conquest of Makka. You do not see his saying to his frightened cousins uncles; "I have forgiven you in the manner Yusuf (Joseph) forgave his brothers who wanted to kill him. We are to learn and take our training behaviour etc from Muhammad and not from those misinterpreting his way of life. There is a lot to learn from the history but it takes me.
Now regarding the Holy Spirit, it is mentioned 4 times in the Qur'an thrice in Medina 2:87, 253, 5:110;  and one in Makka 16:102 before the hijra. It is a term referred to angel Gabriel. When the then disbelievers in Makka accused Muhammad of forgery, Allah told him to tell them, "Ruh Quddus (angel Gabriel) has brought it down from your Lord with truth."  In the Medina verses, the term is attached to Jesus son of Maryam. That is Allah supported him with angel Gabriel.
That is what I read from the Qur'an and not from the Torah or the New Testament. It is unfair and uncivilized for one to dwell into what he does not believe and know. If you do not believe in Islam, then keep it to your self please. I cannot disbelieve in my Book for as a scientist if I am faced with a problem, I refer to my text books. Why should you then force me to ABANDON MY SOURCE OF KNOWLEDGE AND BELIEF? Why are you going to deprive me of my certificates and honor?

Mutakallim.

Greetings mutakallim,

You would not want to follow a science book that gave wrong information and guidance... same with your spiritual book.

"He claims that he is sent by the same One whom sent all Messengers and Prophets to mankind for their salvation."

This is precisely the problem...  You have one man's claims.  The only testimony for Muhammad is himself and a book... and the only testimony to the book is himself and the book which he brings.

And we must ask the question... If Muhammad set such a fine example and rulers accepted islam as the way, how then do you account for their behavior?  Were they following the example of Muhammad or not?  Muhammad set a good example in a few ways, but he set a wrong example in many other ways.  The message to the people taken with him in rulership was a confused message.  He established himself in Yathrib(later named Medina) by raiding the passing caravans on their way to Mecca.  So that even though he wanted to bring a message of God, he established himself in unGodly ways.  And though he pardoned the people whom he then conquered with his might, those people still understood the threat of that might if they did not accept what this new ruler decreed.
So the followers going out after Muhammad's death... did they do any different than follow Muhammad's example in establishing islam?

Salaam and blessings,
Caringheart


Edited by Caringheart - 25 January 2014 at 1:29pm
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
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mutakallim
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Quote mutakallim Replybullet Posted: 25 January 2014 at 11:57pm
Salaam Caringheart.

I was posting under Friendship when that was blocked for an unknown reason. I have expressed myself on that issue you raised earlier. That is what is REAL TRUE and agreed on scientific method.
You do not believe in Muhammad because with all respect you are like a human being without bones for the attachment of muscles, ligament, aponeurosis. This knowledge needs education and you do not base its base. As Muhammad said to those who failed to understand him; You have your own way and I have my own way (obedience to an unseen Power). Let there be no contention. In the long run after death the Supreme Being will judge among his creations.
Remember that I gave this forum references to read but no one is referring to that. First of all learn before you reject or asks questions that cannot be answered in few sentences.

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Quote mutakallim Replybullet Posted: 26 January 2014 at 7:53am
Salaam Neil.


Why not stick to the subject matter : Holy Spirit?

Mutaakallim
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neil
 
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Quote neil Replybullet Posted: 26 January 2014 at 11:45am
what about questions you are not allowed to ask?
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Caringheart
 
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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 26 January 2014 at 1:23pm
Originally posted by mutakallim

Salaam Caringheart.

I was posting under Friendship when that was blocked for an unknown reason.

Mutakallim

Greetings Friendship,

It has been a long time. Smile
I hope that you are doing well.

Salaam and blessings,
Caringheart
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
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Quote mutakallim Replybullet Posted: 27 January 2014 at 10:05am
Salaam Caringheart.

Thanks very much. I am fine and doing well.
I am sad in the sense that it seems there are only those who want to expose their ignorance forgetting that one had to learn English language to participate in this forum. But when it comes to giving obedience to the Lord our Creator, one does not have to learn His Language with its set of rules and regulations.

Mutakallim.
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Quote neil Replybullet Posted: 28 January 2014 at 12:25am
Which subject matter?

Please specify.

Regards

N
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Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 01 February 2014 at 3:03pm
Originally posted by neil

Dear Honeto

So what are you going to ask me?

Regards

Neil

Sorry Neil I was away for a few days. But ask the holy spirit (the one you claim to be God, and the one you claim to dwell in you) this question, my wife has been bugging me about, what is the name of my grandmother from my mother's side?
Good luck!
Hasan.

Edited by honeto - 01 February 2014 at 3:07pm
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
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