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Quote Andalus Replybullet Posted: 09 August 2009 at 11:50pm
Originally posted by Shasta'sAunt

What you seem to place such a huge emphasis on ("tradition") is merely commentary and miniscule in importance to the basic theology: Christ saves.  Also, the Law has remained steadfast:
Do unto others as you would have them do to you.
Love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.
Love your neighbor as yourself.
Honor your father and mother.
Do not bear false testimony.
Do not steal.
Do not commit adultery.
Do not murder.
These laws convict us of sin.  They always have, and they always will.  The Bible may not have a single author, and there may be factual contradictions within it, but the Bible has one coherent thought throughout the entire thing:
No matter what humanity does as it exercises Free Will, God's Will is always done.  God will save His chosen ones...whoever they may be.  He knows who they are--He has known since the beginning of time.  And for those chosen, He has provided salvation through JUSTICE AND MERCY because the Law cannot be abolished, and the debt of sin must be paid.
Now I am confused because every Christian on this forum except you has claimed that the Mosaic Laws no longer matter. Wait, you claimed that also, I believe you said that the gentiles were under the Noahide Laws. So which Law has remained steadfast and cannot be abolished?
According to Jesus that would be the Mosaic Laws. According to every current Christian in the world except you there is no longer any Law because Jesus fulfulled the Law and all of the old covenants no longer matter. According to the Jews, there are 7 Noahide laws, but I fail to see how this has anything to do with Christianity.
Please clarify which Law you are referring to.
I disagree that the Laws convict us of sin, man commits his own sin, the Laws merely state what sins we should strive to avoid. And yes, sin must be paid for, but by the sinner, not a third party. Otherwise what is the point?
It doesn't matter if we have an isnad or not for the gospels or epistles.  It doesn't matter if something was actually written by Paul or a devoted follower was simply writing something under his name (common in 1st & 2nd centuries.)
What matters is the doctrine and beliefs.
But isn't the author the heart of the matter? If you claim to be a Christian and follow the teachings of Jesus, shouldn't you know what those teachings are? Since Paul was not a disciple of Jesus, never met Jesus, and did not become a follower until after the death of Jesus, how is it that the doctrines that Christians follow today are those of Paul?  And most bear little resemblance to anything that Jesus taught, or at least what others have written of the teachings of Jesus. Since Jesus did not leave a written gospel then we will never really know.
Christians quote Mosaic laws out of expediency for the moment, all based upon "conjecture". Jesus never intended to form a new faith. Even Paul is guilty of piouse fraud in his teachings while trying to use the hebrew scriptures to bolster his position.
A feeling of discouragement when you slip up is a sure sign that you put your faith in deeds. -Ibn 'Ata'llah
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Quote Shasta'sAunt Replybullet Posted: 10 August 2009 at 5:05pm
"Christians quote Mosaic laws out of expediency for the moment, all based upon "conjecture". Jesus never intended to form a new faith. Even Paul is guilty of piouse fraud in his teachings while trying to use the hebrew scriptures to bolster his position."
The scriptures of expediency. Jesus was the Messiah because he fulfills the prohesies of the scriptures so therefore we must follow him, but there is no need to follow the Laws that he followed or the doctrines of those same scriptures because they do not apply to you, his followers.
Convoluted at best.

Edited by Shasta'sAunt - 10 August 2009 at 5:09pm
“No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.”
Eleanor Roosevelt
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