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Message Icon Topic: Killing in Pakistan for drinking tea... Post Reply Post New Topic
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Sign*Reader
 
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Quote Sign*Reader Replybullet Posted: 21 June 2009 at 10:35pm
Pati:
Others have touched on some aspects of this incident and I concur with islamispeace...Based on the details in the news which are not much all I can assume and say hapless fella may have belonged to the untouchable dark caste... All I can tell you is that there are millions of these poor stuck in low end of work spectrum i.e., menial and dirty particularly where there no indoor plumbing like the rural areas ...This may not be the case in urban locales...  No one other than their own can eat and drink together...It is just sad but true reality of the third world a former British colony and currently American neo colony that has great disparity in the rights of haves and haves not in economics, living standards and educational oppotunities...
To make their life more difficult the churches with colonial support converted some of them to Christianity...with current American onslaught of the AfPak area who BTW represent Xtian crusade put them in a double jeopardy...Poor guy may be forgot that what the country is going through at the moment! American drones are firing missiles and the puppet government is bombing the Islamist's in the most important areas of the country indiscriminately; turning millions into refugees... it was bound to create some resentment against the dark Xtians!  Remember Americans' reaction after 911...a Sikh got killed cuz he was wearing a turbin...
I don't want to post any link to "You Tube" video cuz some of them are so disgusting that will ruin appetite for the day...You can punch untouchables in there find some yourself...unless you insist!


Edited by Sign*Reader - 21 June 2009 at 11:41pm
Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.
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ops155
 
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Quote ops155 Replybullet Posted: 22 June 2009 at 10:45am
Patty, please answer for why these guys are doing this, you expect someone to explain someone else's actions so you should do the same. Please give details, thanks!!!
 
 
 
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Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 22 June 2009 at 3:37pm
Pati,
its a sad incident if it really had happened. Sign Reader's explaination of the complexity of the issue seems fair and correct. If this story is correct, it may not be taken in religious terms. Here is how:
Think of it as 50's southern United States where a black goes in a restaurant only to serve whites, people get angry and take on the guy. Its not justified at all under any circumstances but that's what probably happened. This guy was propbably from the group that cleans pick up poop from people's toilets, ones without sewer system, they are seen as touching filth and a lot of people don't want to be near them or share their food or cups. Unfortunetly, he happened to be a Christian (if the story is true).
I can tell you that I use to share my food and eat with my friend and a neighbor family, both Christians without any bad feeling. And I personally never witnessed anything of this nature against Christians or Hindus where I lived decades ago.
And such actions are condemned in Islam. And those who did such act (if its true) were not acting according to their belief rather their arrogance and hate, both forbidden in Islam.
 
Hasan 


Edited by honeto - 22 June 2009 at 3:47pm
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
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Pati
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Quote Pati Replybullet Posted: 23 June 2009 at 12:16pm
Hi,
 
Thanks you all for your explanations: Chrysalis, Shasta'sAunt, islamispeace (I like your nickname Wink), Sign*Reader and Honeto.
 
I understand that this man doesn't represent Islam, sure, but also I don't represent the rest of the people, and most of other people (you know it better than me) are still looking at muslims in  distrustfully way. They say that the value of the bad news is hundred times the value of a good one, and in the current times, the bad news are more followed than the goods.
 
Really, I don't want you to think that I brought this story here to hurt you as muslims, just to show you a fact: I received this by mail, from 3 different people who don't know each other (even, everyone is from different region of Spain!!)...
 
I am sorry, and I know that it's not fair for a whole community to be shown only after a bad action of one of them... but unfortunately, that happens. I know lot of muslims, I went on holidays to a muslim country and it was great, I am studying arabic free in a Mosque (at the same time I am learning a little bit of Islam)... I know the good part of Islam and of muslims, but you have to get relation with other people, and if someone is rejecting you, just smile because most probably he is a short minded person!!
 
 
 
Originally posted by ops155

Patty, please answer for why these guys are doing this, you expect someone to explain someone else's actions so you should do the same. Please give details, thanks!!!
 
 
 
 
Hi ops155,
 
The answer is so simple: they are not true christians, if their aim is to kill someone. And if they just think about it, they will receive the repulse from the Church in first place, including the Christians, in the same way that the christians are repulsing every kind of abuses or killing.
 
But be sure, if this association is just hurting any muslim, our voice against them will be very clear. Actually, if they didn't do it before, I'm sure it's because no one knows them (sorry if I am wrong, but I have no idea about who they are).
 
A true christian is against every kind of violence, and if the only reason which generates this violence is a different religion, we will shout loudly against them.
 
Do you think it's enough explanation? If you need more details, just ask me!!
No God wants the killing, but the peace.
The weapons are carried by people, not by religions.
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Quote Angel Replybullet Posted: 23 June 2009 at 8:08pm

To those who think muslims can explain this incident: It is silly to expect muslims to explain this, obviously this is one man, one out of billion plus, this is not a reflection of the muslim population world wide or Pakistan (not that I have been to pakistan). If the customer saw the sign perhaps he should have obeyed it or just asked why? NOT that I am saying it is his fault for dying but if someone has a sign about something then maybe do what it says. Man I know quite well when people don't read or just ignore signs, I get this at work, i think its just human nature but if there is a sign obviously there is a reason. If this shop owner doesn't want non muslims I think it is his choice (even if it is discrimination from others perspective).

Of course I don't agree with the killing!!! maybe the ower should have charged for the tea double or triple.
~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
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Quote Doo-bop Replybullet Posted: 25 June 2009 at 4:24am
This atrocity is sadly so typical of the "Islamic" Republic of Pakistan, a country, incidentally, where all signs are of very limited value, as so few people can read..... 
 
 
The above link claims that the perpetrator of this evil, Ali the tea-shop owner, had not even been arrested, but that Muhammad Iftikhar Bajwa, police chief at Pindi Bhatian Saddar police station, stated that he could not take the sign down........
 
Go here, to the Asian News, to see what witnesses claimed happened, and for the extent of our dear brother Ishtiaq's injuries which lead to his death -
 
 
If anyone has information as to how "investigations" into this evil are progressing, please convey them to us.  (Who knows, perhaps they are claiming there is a shortage of witnesses, or some other pathetic excuse Confused)  It is only to be hoped and prayed that believing Christian people will not respond in kind to the vile attitudes and actions of these evil people


Edited by Doo-bop - 25 June 2009 at 4:43am
"Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world" - John the Baptizer (John 1:29)
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Quote Shasta'sAunt Replybullet Posted: 25 June 2009 at 2:46pm
"This atrocity is sadly so typical of the "Islamic" Republic of Pakistan, a country, incidentally, where all signs are of very limited value, as so few people can read....." 
 
I know, we have this same problem in the United States. Signs everywhere, but no-one reads them. Like when people ignore the "No Weapons" signs and go into public places, schools, or churches heavily armed and massacre anyone unfortunate enough to be within gunshot range.
 
You know, like the recent shooting at the Holocaust Museum. Or the shooting of Dr. George Tiller in church by that anti-abortion Christian man who claims more killings will occur.
 
Here good Christians protest on behalf of the shooter at the doctor's funeral.  Nice pic, too bad it wouldn't copy over.
Previous 9 of 119 Next

FILE - In this Saturday June 6, 2009 file photo, Protesters from Rev. Fred Phelps' Westboro Baptist Church demonstrate during funeral services for Dr. George Tiller at College Hill United Methodist Church in Wichita, Kan. Tiller, 67, a late-term abortion provider, was shot in the head Sunday as he handed out programs while ushering at Reformation Lutheran Church in Wichita. Scott Roeder, a 51-year-old abortion opponent, was arrested a few hours later just outside Kansas City. Abortion providers say that threats of more slayings from the man accused Tiller's shooting, proves the existence of a 'violent, terrorist movement' coalescing around the issue.



Edited by Shasta'sAunt - 25 June 2009 at 2:54pm
“No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.”
Eleanor Roosevelt
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Doo-bop
 
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Quote Doo-bop Replybullet Posted: 26 June 2009 at 2:16am
ooops, you missed the whole point again, Auntie
 
Do you have signs in the US saying you have to declare your religion in a tea shop, so they can give you a seperate cup, because you are somehow unclean? 
 
Even if you did, would the penalty imposed by the owner on the person ignoring/not seeing the sign be death? 
 
Would the family of the dead man then have to go and register a case with the police?  Or would the police be on the scene almost instantly?
 
Would the authorities say they were not able to remove the evil sign?
 
Would the perpetrators still be at large, if the police knew where they were?
"Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world" - John the Baptizer (John 1:29)
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