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Mansoor_ali
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Quote Mansoor_ali Replybullet Posted: 07 May 2010 at 11:32am

 To JOUBERAR

 

Misquoting%20Jesus:%20The%20Story%20Behind%20Who%20Changed%20the%20Bible%20and%20Why



 Visit: Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed The Bible and Why from Prof. Bart Ehrman (New Testament scholar)
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Mansoor_ali
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Quote Mansoor_ali Replybullet Posted: 07 May 2010 at 12:40pm

 To JOUBERAR

 Was Jairus' daughter alive or dead when he came to Jesus?

 Daughter was dead (Matthew 9:18) - "While He was saying these things to them, behold, there came a synagogue official, and bowed down before Him, saying, "My daughter has just died; but come and lay Your hand on her, and she will live."

 Daughter at point of death (Mark 5:23) - "And one of the synagogue officials named Jairus *came up, and upon seeing Him, *fell at His feet, 23and *entreated Him earnestly, saying, "My little daughter is at the point of death; please come and lay Your hands on her, that she may get well and live." 24And He went off with him; and a great multitude was following Him and pressing in on Him."

 My Comments: In Mark Jarius says his daughter IS DYING (so, she is still alive). Only later do some men from Jairus' home inform him that his daughter has died.  But in Matthew Jairus says to Jesus (peace be upon him) that his daughter is ALREADY DEAD. The two are not the same.

 
In Mark Jarius requests Jesus (peace be upon him) to HEAL his daughter. But in Matthew there is no mention of 'healing' since the daughter is ALREADY DEAD and, therefore, she only needs to be brought back to life so she can live.

 
No such differences are to be seen in the Quran.

 
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JOUBERAR
 
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Quote JOUBERAR Replybullet Posted: 07 May 2010 at 3:58pm
Originally posted by honeto

Jouberar,
it was the Bible that was kept away from common man. Only the priests were the ones that had access to it. It was read and interpreted to common man by the priest. This was one of the main reason for Christians to form Protestant denominations.
In Islam, however, there was no such control to this day. Quran has been available to anyone who wants to read and understand it. It is the Final word of God for mankind and any that seek and benefit from it have that chance.
Hasan
 
That doesn't make it the word of GOD AND LEAST NOT THE FINAL WORD OF WHAT....... WHERE IS YOUR STAMP of APPROVAL.


Edited by JOUBERAR - 07 May 2010 at 4:50pm
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Quote JOUBERAR Replybullet Posted: 07 May 2010 at 4:07pm
Originally posted by Mansoor_ali


 To JOUBERAR

 Was Jairus' daughter alive or dead when he came to Jesus?

 Daughter was dead (Matthew 9:18) - "While He was saying these things to them, behold, there came a synagogue official, and bowed down before Him, saying, "My daughter has just died; but come and lay Your hand on her, and she will live."

 Daughter at point of death (Mark 5:23) - "And one of the synagogue officials named Jairus *came up, and upon seeing Him, *fell at His feet, 23and *entreated Him earnestly, saying, "My little daughter is at the point of death; please come and lay Your hands on her, that she may get well and live." 24And He went off with him; and a great multitude was following Him and pressing in on Him."

 My Comments: In Mark Jarius says his daughter IS DYING (so, she is still alive). Only later do some men from Jairus' home inform him that his daughter has died.  But in Matthew Jairus says to Jesus (peace be upon him) that his daughter is ALREADY DEAD. The two are not the same.

 
In Mark Jarius requests Jesus (peace be upon him) to HEAL his daughter. But in Matthew there is no mention of 'healing' since the daughter is ALREADY DEAD and, therefore, she only needs to be brought back to life so she can live.

 
No such differences are to be seen in the Quran.

 
 
What then you have never open the Quran with all its errors and a lot of it. 

In the quran there are errors in the historical events as:

1) Virgin Mary

In the Prohibition chapter (Surat At-Tahrim) 12:" And Maryam (Mary), the daughter of

'Imran who guarded her chastity"

And in Mary chapter (Surat Maryam) 27, 28:"Then she brought him to her people,

carrying him. They said: O sister of Hrn, Your father was not a man who used to

commit adultery, nor your mother was an unchaste woman."

So the quran said that Maryam (Mary) the mother of the Christ, was the daughter of

'Imran and the sister of Hrn

The Holy Bible is telling that Mary was the daughter of Yoakum

Muhammad confused with Maryam the prophetess, the sister of Hrn that was mentioned in Exodus 15:20 with Maryam (Mary) the mother of the Christ

The Holy Bible said in 1Chronicles 6:3:"the children of Amram: Hrn, and Moses, and

Maryam. The sons of Aaron: Nadab, and Abihu, Eleazar, and Ithamar" so Maryam was the daughter of Amram according to the history and the Holy Bible

So he changed the name Amram to 'Imran and considered Virgin Mary to be Maryam the sister of Hrn and Moses and the daughter of 'Imran, although she was not the same

person How could Mary the mother of the Christ be the daughter of 'Imran and the sister of

Hrn and Moses and there are 1500 years between Virgin Mary and the time of Hrn

Does God mistake in history?

2) The birth of the Christ:

About the birth of the Christ the quran mentioned in

Mary chapter (Surat Maryam) 22-26:" "So she conceived him, and she withdrew with him to a far place and the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a date-palm. She said:

"Would that I had died before this, and had been forgotten and out of sight!" Then he

(babe Jesus) cried unto her from below her, saying: "Grieve not! Your Lord has provided

a water stream under you; "And shake the trunk of date-palm towards you, it will let fall

fresh ripe-dates upon you." "So eat and drink and be glad, and if you see any human

being, say: 'Verily! I have vowed a fast unto the Most Beneficent Allah"

That story is totally different in all aspects of that mentioned in the Holy Bible about the

birth of the Christ

In Luke 2: 1-7:" Now it happened in those days, that a decree went out from Caesar

Augustus that all the world should be enrolled. This was the first enrolment made when Quirinius was governor of Syria. All went to enrol themselves, everyone to his own city.

Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judea, to the city of

David, which is called Bethlehem, because he was of the house and family of David; to

enrol himself with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him as wife, being pregnant. It happened, while they were there, that the day had come that she should give birth. She brought forth her firstborn son, and she wrapped him in bands of cloth, and laid him in a feeding trough, because there was no room for them in the inn."

So according to the history and the Holy Bible the Christ was bon in Bethlehem where

there is the place of the Christ's birth that's visited by many people till now

But that story mentioned in the quran was the story of Hager the mother of Ismail who

went to a far place beside a date-palm and an angel appeared to her, and there was a

river beside her, that is the story Mohammed had quoted in the quran and he attributed it wrongly to the birth of the Christ

We are asking how he ordered her shake the trunk of date-palm towards her, how could she do that while she was just gave birth to a child, and was definitely exhausted? , and why he didnt shake it for her? He who brought for her a water stream below her can also shake for her the date-palm

And how he asked her to eat and drink, and if she sees any human being, she would say" I have vowed a fast unto the Most Beneficent Allah" was he asking her to lie ?

Someone may say that she might be fasting on talking and not fasting on food

That's not possible as fasting was not mentioned in any book as fasting on talking and

not food, and she was already talking saying : "Would that I had died before this, and had been forgotten and out of sight!"

3) Pharaoh and his Minister Hmn

The Narration chapter (Surat Al-Qasas) 8, 38:" Then the household of Pharaoh picked

him up, that he might become for them an enemy and a cause of grief. Verily! Pharaoh,

Hmn and their hosts were sinners, Pharaoh said:"O chiefs! I know not that you have a god other than me, so kindle for me a fire, O Hmn, bake clay, and set up for me a palace in order that I may look at God of Moses "

So according to the quran Hmn was the Minister of Pharaoh

While the Holy Bible is telling that Hmn was the Minister of King Ahasuerus the king of Persians on 486 B.C (book of ester), the name Hmn was the mane of Persian god

Pharaoh of Egypt lived on 1490 B.C ,so there was a thousand year time difference between them, and Hmn could never be a name at the time of Pharaoh as the Egyptians were not using names of Persian gods but their own gods ,as using that name is impossible being against their worshiping

So Pharaoh of Egypt could never had a minister named Hmn and the name was taken from a man lived a thousand year later

4) Moses and the Samaritan:

It was mentioned in the quran that the Samaritan was the one who made the golden

statue of calf for the people of Israel in the desert at the time of Moses

In Ta-Ha chapter (Surat Ta-Ha) 85 88:" and the Samaritan has led them astray He said: "O my people! Did not your Lord promise you a fair promise? Did then the promise seem to you long in coming? Or did you desire that wrath should descend from your Lord on you, so you broke your promise to me They said: "We broke not the promise to you, of our own will, but we were made to carry the weight of the ornaments of the people, then we cast them into the fire, and that was what the Samaritan suggested." Then he took out of the fire for them a statue of a calf which seemed to low. They said: "This is your god and the god of Moses"

The Samaritan (the one who lived in the city of Samara) was not known at the time of

Moses as the city of Samara was not existing at the time of Moses, as the history is

telling us that it was built on 880 B.C, while Moses lived on 1500B.C, so there is seven

centuries difference between the two, and no one was called the Samaritan at the time of Moses

Besides those historical errors of the quran, there are also contradictions in the events

within the quran itself

As an example of that is:

The fate of the Pharaoh of Egypt

The story was mentioned in two places in the quran:

The Narration chapter (Surat Al-Qasas) 40: "So we seized him and his hosts, and we

threw them all into the sea"

While in Jonah chapter (Surat Yunus) 90 -92:" And We took the Children of Israel across the sea, and Pharaoh with his hosts followed them in oppression and enmity, till when

drowning overtook him, he said: "I believe that none has the right to be worshipped but

God, in whom the Children of Israel believe, and I am one of the Muslims.. So this day we shall rescue your body that you may be a sign to those who come after you! "

So in one verse it said that he died with his people drowning in the sea, while in another verse it said he was rescued from death as he believed in God

So did he die in the sea or was rescued? It's an obvious contradiction within the quran itself

The definite answer for that, we can find in the Holy bible in

Exodus 14:28 :" The waters returned, and covered the chariots and the horsemen, even

all Pharaoh's army that went in after them into the sea. There remained not so much as

one of them"

And in psalms 136:15:" overthrew Pharaoh and his army in the Red Sea; for his loving

kindness endures forever:

They are telling that Pharaoh and all his soldiers drowned into the sea

And also it was documented in the history that pharaoh of Egypt during the time of

Moses drowned in the sea

 
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Quote JOUBERAR Replybullet Posted: 07 May 2010 at 4:11pm
Originally posted by Mansoor_ali


 To JOUBERAR

 

Misquoting%20Jesus:%20The%20Story%20Behind%20Who%20Changed%20the%20Bible%20and%20Why



 Visit: Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed The Bible and Why from Prof. Bart Ehrman (New Testament scholar)
 
This is not shopping on line bookstore show me the facts, I am not misquoting Jesus it is the muslims that are misquoting Jesus authority that he received from God to everyone who believes in him.
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Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 12 May 2010 at 11:00pm
Originally posted by JOUBERAR

Originally posted by honeto

Jouberar,it was the Bible that was kept away from common man. Only the priests were the ones that had access to it. It was read and interpreted to common man by the priest. This was one of the main reason for Christians to form Protestant denominations.In Islam, however, there was no such control to this day. Quran has been available to anyone who wants to read and understand it. It is the Final word of God for mankind and any that seek and benefit from it have that chance.Hasan

That doesn't make it the word of GOD AND LEAST NOT THE FINAL WORD OF WHAT.......WHERE IS YOUR STAMP ofAPPROVAL.



Jouberar,
I agree that God does not stamp or use a seal as the Queen or the President do, but here is how we separate what is from God and what is not.
Here is a simple rule I follow, it helps me to sort things out easily and then put my trust in God and grow in belief and faith. Say, for example we take this important point:
God is One.
A simple and clear statement and I only find the Quran to be 100% consistent, honestly. Other major beliefs and their sources contradict on that simple truth, can you believe that?
I think this only point is enough to open and close a discussion for me. If you and your source cannot go even beyond this first and the most important point, you are not doing yourself any good.
Hasan

Edited by honeto - 12 May 2010 at 11:03pm
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
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Quote Mahdi The Seeke Replybullet Posted: 03 August 2012 at 11:43pm
I am a muslim and i believe the Bible is not corrupt. That was the way it was written. People compiled it and canonized it and came up with the finished product. There was not an original Bible which was later altered. Although even today the protestant and catholic Bibles have different number of books, it was a matter of difference of opinion on canonicity of some books and not whether one version had been altered or corrupted.
The real question is, Is the Bible the word of God?


PS:When making any claim eg orion's belt or milky way, please quote the reference.
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Quote Mahdi The Seeke Replybullet Posted: 04 August 2012 at 1:13am
I am a muslim and i believe the Bible is not corrupt. That was the way it was written. People compiled it and canonized it and came up with the finished product. There was not an original Bible which was later altered. Although even today the protestant and catholic Bibles have different number of books, it was a matter of difference of opinion on canonicity of some books and not whether one version had been altered or corrupted.
The real question is, Is the Bible the word of God?


PS:When making any claim eg orion's belt or milky way, please quote the reference.
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