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Interfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Interfaith Dialogue
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JOUBERAR
 
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Quote JOUBERAR Replybullet Posted: 21 July 2009 at 3:43pm
Originally posted by Akhe Abdullah

[Jouberar]Thats what the muslims trying to rub in to others brains so that they can think he was very poor and have compassion with Muhammad, but why did he then accumumalated spoils of war is the same as accumumalate wealth he use to spend it for his on wealth do you think he will just store it in the back of his tent look how many wifes could he afford then he gave orders to other muslims they can have only more than one wife if they can afford it.(Muhammad could afford he had the wealth)

[Akhe Abdullah]Who say he (SAW)accumulated booty?You lie!The Spoils of War(The Life of Muhammad by Haykal pg 315) The Prophet(SAW) divided the properties,women,and children of Banu Qurayzah among the Muslims after he had separated one-fifth for public purposes.Look I know you hate Muslims and Islam stop spreading lies and slandering our beloved Prophet(SAW). He was the best of people.
 
So you accepted that he also steal woman and children in his blood thirsty and property thirsty wars and divided them among the muslims is that with a acceptable yes.
 
Then one fifth of stolen raided goods goes for muslims public purposes is that with an acceptable yes.
 
So islam and Muhammad thrive on the goods stolen in war thats why the wars must go on and on to donate to islam's fast growing wealth.   
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Akhe Abdullah
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Quote Akhe Abdullah Replybullet Posted: 21 July 2009 at 3:48pm
Many Christians,have attacked the person of Muhammad and attributed to him the most unbecoming epithets there by giving vent to their resentment and sowing the seeds of hatred and hostility.Despite the commonly held view that the Crusades have long been finished and forgotten,fanatic Christian antagonism still continues to rage against Muhammed.The present situation has not changed except for the worse.Moved by the same fanaticism,the missionaries resort to immoral and depraved means in theirstruggle against Islam.(THE LIFE OF MUHAMMED xxxv Haykal)copy right 1976

Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 21 July 2009 at 3:52pm
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JOUBERAR
 
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Quote JOUBERAR Replybullet Posted: 21 July 2009 at 9:28pm
Originally posted by Akhe Abdullah

Many Christians,have attacked the person of Muhammad and attributed to him the most unbecoming epithets there by giving vent to their resentment and sowing the seeds of hatred and hostility.Despite the commonly held view that the Crusades have long been finished and forgotten,fanatic Christian antagonism still continues to rage against Muhammed.The present situation has not changed except for the worse.Moved by the same fanaticism,the missionaries resort to immoral and depraved means in theirstruggle against Islam.(THE LIFE OF MUHAMMED xxxv Haykal)copy right 1976
 
Who ordered the crusades the Pope or Christ the muslims have no back bone thats why always seek refuge by means of the crusade while the muslim were main cause that started the crusade after they raided and stole Jerusalem from the Jews and there excuse for the wrong doing in islam is look at the crusade look what the christians have done, but they are not looking back and seen what the muslims have done no that was right because Allah permited it.
The crusades was wrong and that was not an order God or Christ.
In the eyes of God,Jesus and real christian and in me point of view it is totally wrong for a christian to go war, our war is not against "flesh blood" and the church ministers gave the wrong education to thier members christian must take part in any form of war or even think of murder, war is murder and Jesus said we must not even hate your brother and love those who hate you, war is absolutely taboo for Christians.
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Quote Akhe Abdullah Replybullet Posted: 22 July 2009 at 9:43am
[Jouberar]christian must take part in any form of war or even think of murder, war is murder and Jesus said we must not even hate your brother and love those who hate you, war is absolutely taboo for Christians.    [Akhe Abdullah]Even in your own words, that these clearly are, you contradict yourself and what you claim Christians to believe.Take a closer look at what you wrote.
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Quote Akhe Abdullah Replybullet Posted: 22 July 2009 at 9:58am
Originally posted by JOUBERAR

Originally posted by Akhe Abdullah

Many Christians,have attacked the person of Muhammad and attributed to him the most unbecoming epithets there by giving vent to their resentment and sowing the seeds of hatred and hostility.Despite the commonly held view that the Crusades have long been finished and forgotten,fanatic Christian antagonism still continues to rage against Muhammed.The present situation has not changed except for the worse.Moved by the same fanaticism,the missionaries resort to immoral and depraved means in theirstruggle against Islam.(THE LIFE OF MUHAMMED xxxv Haykal)copy right 1976
 

Who ordered the crusades the Pope or Christ the muslims have no back bone thats why always seek refuge by means of the crusade while the muslim were main cause that started the crusade after they raided and stole Jerusalem from the Jews and there excuse for the wrong doing in islam is look at the crusade look what the christians have done, but they are not looking back and seen what the muslims have done no that was right because Allah permited it.

The crusades was wrong and that was not an order God or Christ.

In the eyes of God,Jesus and real christian and in me point of view it is totally wrong for a christian to go war, our war is not against "flesh blood" and the church ministers gave the wrong education to thier members christian must take part in any form of war or even think of murder, war is murder and Jesus said we must not even hate your brother and love those who hate you, war is absolutely taboo for Christians.
The First Principles of the Two Religions:(Haykal) Muslims rejoicing at the victory of Heraclius and his Christian armies was great.Despite the many controversies that had taken place between the followers of Muhammad and those who believed in Jesus,their friendly and fraternal relationships continued to be strong throughout the life of the Prophet.

Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 22 July 2009 at 10:02am
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Quote Akhe Abdullah Replybullet Posted: 22 July 2009 at 12:27pm
[Jouberar]it is totally wrong for a christian to go war,                                                                                                         [Akhe Abdullah]Christianity and Fighting.The missionaries say,"But the spirit of Christianity condemns fighting altogether."I do not wish to pause here for investigating the truth,or lack of it,of such a claim.The history of Christianity,however,is a legitamate witness in this matter and so is the history of Islam.From the dawn of Christianity until today every country of the world has been soaked with blood in the name of Jesus Christ.The Romans and the Byzantines of old as well as European peoples of modern times are guilty of shedding blood in religious causes.The Crusades were launched and their fires fanned by Christians,not by Muslims.For hundred of years,one army after another rolled out of Europe in direction of the Muslims Orient to fight,to destroy and to shed blood.In every case,the popes who claimed to be the vicars of Jesus Christ,bleesed and encouraged these armies and hurried them to Jerusalem and other destinations.Were all these popes heretics? Was their Christianity spurious? Or was every one of them a pretender,an ignoramus,unaware that Christianity absolutely condemns fighting?The missionaries rejoin,"Those were the middle Ages,ages f darkness, unfit as evidence agaianst Christianity."If this is an argument on which they pin some hope,let us then turn to "the twentieth century of the highest human civilization."This century has indeed seen the same darkness as did the Middle Ages,Lord Allenby,representing the allied forces of England,France,Italy,Romania,and America,stopped in Jerusalem in 1918 after his conquest of that city toward the end of the first World War and said:"Today the Crusades have come to an end."

Edited by Akhe Abdullah - 22 July 2009 at 7:38pm
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Quote kapalu Replybullet Posted: 09 August 2009 at 5:42pm
Greetings:

I will attempt to deal with all 60 questions. However not all at the same time.

I will begin with the first 14 dealing with the nature of God according to the christian view.

Now first remember that Christianity is seen as an extension of Judaism by true Christians.

Now ancient Israel believed that there was only ONE God. Take a look at Deuteronomy 4:35; 6:4, Isaiah 45:5, Zech 14:9.

The new testament makes the same claims. (please take a look at  mark 12:29-32, 1 cor 8:4-6, Eph 4:4-6; 1 Tim 2:5)

However the emphasis on one God does not contradict the Christian concept of the triune God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit).

The texts simply affirms that there is no pantheon of various gods or deities.

So then how do Christians arrive to the conclusion that the ONE God is Father Son and Spirit?

Well lets begin in the Torah( Old testament):

Well the Old Testement even though it does not explicitly tech that God is triune, it alludes to a plurality within the Godhead.

Gen 1:26 - Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”

Gen 3:22 - Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”

Gen 11:7 - Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another’s speech.”

So clearly the Prophet Moses is alluding to the plurality of God. Why someone talk to himself and refer to himself as US, OUR, WE.

Now many people would say that this type of language was pretty standard for royalty. For example, Queen victoria or maybe elizabeth 1 (i cant remember right now) was well known for referring to herself in the plural. Famous remarks like -"We are not pleased"..... and the like.

There is a problem with this though. There is not any evidence whatsoever of any ancient figure refering to themselves as such, in the the ancient world; furthermore in the middle east, north africa or the mediterranean.

Such use of language is fairly recent not more that 500 years old and originating in northern europe.

So when someone says WE, US, OUR in ancient hebrew texts.... It means exactly that. That this is a conversation between 2 or more individuals.

Other Text to Look at:

Now Various references distinguish the Spirit of God from God.

Gen 1:1-3 -  1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was[a] on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.
3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light.

It would seem here that God and the Spirit of God are two separate entities.

Some references not only refer to the Spirit, but include a Third Person in God's work. look at the texts below.

Isa 48:16 (read it yourself) This chapter has prophetic significance regarding the coming Messiah (who Christians believe was Jesus)

The truth is that i hate to give these small reference text. When reading the hebrew scriptures, CONTEXT is important. I would prefer that anyone reading this read the entire books of Genesis and Exedous. Things start to fit together and you see more clearly the allusion to a plural God.

Wow..... that was long !!

Okay so I will stop here for now. My next post will attempt to answer in detail the first 14 questions.

This post will form part of the premises used.

Notice these references are from the Law(Torah) and the Prophets (old testament)

Now these are just a handful of references alluding to the plurality of God. There are many more.

Well see you next time then.
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Quote Shibboleth Replybullet Posted: 14 August 2009 at 12:33pm
""59.As a Christian, do you agree that out of fairness and honesty you must investigate what Islam says about God, Jesus, including this life and the hereafter?""

Please read my posts under Intrafaith Discussion, Islamic Dialogue and Prophet-Mohammad to answer your following questions.


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