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   MOCKBA, I was not misinterpreting the hadith at all, YOU were misinterpreting my point. I'm not passing judgement on whom was responsible for the london bombings, so I'm not declaring my opinion on the subject of murder in islamic jurisprudence, all I was pointing out with that hadith was that regardless of your opinion of these militants, you can't say they're not Muslims when they are still believers.
And Allah knows best.

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AK47 Newbie Joined: 09 July 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 7	Posted: 10 July 2005 at 11:46pm
	MOCKBA, I was not misinterpreting the hadith at all, YOU were misinterpreting my point. I'm not passing judgement on whom was responsible for the london bombings, so I'm not declaring my opinion on the subject of murder in islamic jurisprudence, all I was pointing out with that hadith was that regardless of your opinion of these militants, you can't say they're not Muslims when they are still believers. And Allah knows best.
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Lameese Female Senior Member Joined: 08 April 2002 Online Status: Offline Posts: 307	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 12:15am
	Well, then we have to question if they are believers. Either you believe in Qur'an and Hadeeth or you do not. You cannot say, ok, I will believe in this and do it but I will believe how I want to on another point and go against the Qur'an and then go on to say you totally believe in Islam either. But you seem to know better......... Lameese
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MOCKBA Moderator Group Joined: 27 September 2000 Location: Malaysia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1410	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 12:15am
	Bismillah Thank you for correction. It was in my assumption that they were suicide bombers that perished at the time of committing the grave sin. On the other hand, there are conditions whereby a person is put outside of the fold of Islam, very often when one's faith is not manifested through his/ her deeds. And Allah knows best.
	MOCKBA
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herjihad Senior Member Joined: 26 January 2005 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2473	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 4:33am
	Bismillah, May Allah, SWT, bless and guide the people devastated by bombings each day.
	Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.
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Clarabelle Newbie Joined: 07 July 2005 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 31	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 5:58am
	It is grey area in many faiths it seems. If you do wrong/ break the rules you can be forgiven if truly repentant. However, if you commit the sinful act kowing that it is wrong but with it in mind that you will be forgiven.... Only our creator can judge, he does indeed know best. I am not familiar enough yet with the Islamic faith. I want to learn more. I do not understand the terms used etc. Please forgive me if I offend by using the wrong terms, I do not mean to. Is a hadith a teaching? Clara
	"We look forward to the time when the power of love will replace the love of power. Then will our world know the blessing of peace." William Ewart Gladstone
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herjihad Senior Member Joined: 26 January 2005 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2473	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 11:54am
	Bismillah, Clara, Look under Quran and Sunna on the main page to study the basics. A hadith is a saying or action of the prophet Muhammad, SAW, which was observed and recorded.
	Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.
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Lameese Female Senior Member Joined: 08 April 2002 Online Status: Offline Posts: 307	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 12:07pm
	Clara, Make sure the hadeeths you are reading are the true words of the Prophet. You can find many authentic materials out there that give the true hadeeths. Lameese
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Sophie_J Starter Joined: 25 March 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 5	Posted: 11 July 2005 at 1:25pm
	Asalaamu Alaykum I live in London and regularly travel to the areas where the bombs went off; my husband and his brother are both bus drivers in central London and both work for the company whose bus was blown up; that company is very very fair and in many areas the majority of its employees and managers are Muslim. My husband's brother often drives the number 30 bus and it was his friend who was driving that day. The people supporting this action obviously don't know Britain and London in particular; where two of the bombs went off are majority Muslim areas; also at least one, possibly two of the bombs went off in George Galloway's electoral constituency; George Galloway was voted in by all people of his community and the Labour MP was voted out, because the people in that area did not support Iraq and the British government; Mr Galloway is very close to Islam and some say he already reverted, his wife is certainly Muslim, she is Palestinian. Another thing is the majority in the UK did not vote for Tony Blair in the last election but due to the flawed democracy here; they still got in; still in London Labour lost many many seats in parliament because of their role in Iraq. One of my Muslim friends has lost her best friend, her father is critically ill in hospital and her brother has lost his hearing; if you think this is jihad then Allah help you is all I can say Sophie
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