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Groups – Men (Brothers)
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Culture & Community : Groups – Men (Brothers)
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Israfil
 
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Quote Israfil Replybullet Topic: The goal of Men
    Posted: 22 June 2005 at 6:14pm

The conduct of a Muslim man is very important, not only is because he is an example of teaching, but as a man. To be upright, truthful, honesty and caring are just brief components of what makes a Muslim man. The primary goal for a Muslim man is to obtain the highest level of intimacy with God. His second and most important duty is to his family. Of course the word family, encompasses a lot of things but in this case I mention the immediate family such as his wife and children(or child).

A man's efforts to his family must also reflect the efforts to his deen. If he cannot be consistent in his efforts he must strive to be consistent. Perfection should not be his goal. Men must not allow themselves to believe that he and she can be perfect or even strive to be, because as God has mentioned he will test our every move in life.

Men must be self-conscious of themselves spiritually, as well as maintain a clean hygeine. Men must also be ever cognizant God. Even if one is not consistent with prayer one should strive to be consistent, and if that is difficult at least be mindful of God and his promises to mankind.

Men must respect people of all cultures and nationalities and must free themselves from those who are opposite. Men must be kind, and caring. Men must learn how to handle differences especially those who disagree with Islam. Men must learn to use their mind as well as their intellect to help themselves solve their life issues rather using violence to solve them.

Men must be kind to women. Men must try to make an effort to empathize with his wife when she cannot. Men must learn to accept a woman's mistake and forgive her and continue to build their life around each other. A man must learn to accept a woman for who she is not who she was and must build from the imperfections that both come to apprehend from each other. Most importantlya man should try to reflect the love of God to his woman and be the very clothing that shades her from harm.

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Arabian
 
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Quote Arabian Replybullet Posted: 22 June 2005 at 6:53pm

These male attributes are indeed essential towards the Muslim man living in a Muslim community.  However, in my own community, where arranged marriage is not an option, following these qualities will doom you to failure.

I can understand having a Muslim wife, or a wife that has been raised around Muslim communities, as to why being ‘kind’ is accepted, but I have found that in my community, with my experience with women, that women see kindness as a weakness in a man.  Instead I have found that women are more attracted to the man who is aloof, careless, arrogant, and wild in nature.  I am not saying abusive, that definitely is out of the question.

What I am saying is that those attributes that you have described are indeed ‘good’ qualities to have, but in a western community you wont get very far.

I agree with:

If he cannot be consistent in his efforts he must strive to be consistent.

-         I agree, as this will only make you a better person.

Men must not allow themselves to believe that he and she can be perfect or even strive to be.

-         The man who strives for perfection is indeed foolish, we must know our limitations.

Men must be self-conscious of themselves spiritually, as well as maintain a clean hygeine.

-         Agreed, who would want to talk to a dirty person anyways?

Men must learn how to handle differences especially those who disagree with Islam. Men must learn to use their mind as well as their intellect to help themselves solve their life issues rather using violence to solve them.

  •  - Agreed.

Men must be kind to women.

  •  - Yes, definitely.

Men must learn to accept a woman's mistake and forgive her and continue to build their life around each other.

  •  - Yes, but you need to know when enough is enough.  There are plenty of women in the world; you don’t need to be obsessed with this one.  No one woman is the absolute perfect woman; there are so many others who can be better than the one you are with.  If she is going too far, then you obviously did something wrong.  Perhaps she is in control of the relationship, in any case, you didn’t perform your duty as a man to keep her attracted to you, and to keep her craving your attention.

A man must learn to accept a woman for who she is not who she was and must build from the imperfections that both come to apprehend from each other.

  •  - I agree with this, but you mustn’t forget who she was, as the past has a nasty habit of creeping back up to the present.  I am only saying to take caution.

Most importantlya man should try to reflect the love of God to his woman and be the very clothing that shades her from harm.

  •  - I agree, men should always protect their women.

I disagree with:

Men must respect people of all cultures and nationalities and must free themselves from those who are opposite.

-         A man must have his opinion on certain issues.  If you don’t like something, say it, and say it with a passion.  You don’t need to free yourself from anybody; guard yourself against those that oppose you and make your position clear, that is how you earn respect.

Men must be kind, and caring.

-         Again with this kind and caring.  I don’t agree with this.  Yes, men should display some benevolence, but to always be kind and caring is to always be weak.  Believe me, as soon as I dropped the whole kind and caring bit, my relationship with women became much more powerful.  Again, I don’t mean being abusive.  If you are abusive towards women then you deserve to go to jail.

Men must try to make an effort to empathize with his wife when she cannot.

-         I agree with this to a certain extent.  You should listen to you wife, but you should never try to solve her problem unless she asks you to.  Most of the time women just want to talk; they don’t need you to get involved.

Over all I agreed with most of your guidelines, however, I had to disagree with those few.

Peace,
Arabian

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ZamanH
 
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Quote ZamanH Replybullet Posted: 24 June 2005 at 6:31am

A man should be good to his wife. He should take care of her and try his best to provide for her and should not torture her mentally and physically. But if he tries to pretend what he is not, I don't think he will be able to do that for long.

An enemy of an enemy is a fickle friend.
There will be more women in hell than men.
..for persecution is worse than the slaughter of the enemy..(Quran 2:191)
Heaven lies under mother's feet
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Lameese
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Quote Lameese Replybullet Posted: 24 June 2005 at 11:55am

ZamanH

According to you, you can just get another wife and trade them out.

You Shall be together when the white wings of death scatter your days.
Let the winds of the heavens dance between you.
Love one another and let it be a moving sea between the the shores of your soul
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Israfil
 
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Quote Israfil Replybullet Posted: 24 June 2005 at 6:14pm

As'Salaamu Alaikum,

Arabian I read your long response and quite frankly that is a sad tale. From your response it appears that you were commenting on a cultural....ah well nevermind its pointless to talk here anymore

 

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Arabian
 
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Quote Arabian Replybullet Posted: 24 June 2005 at 10:22pm

Salam Israfil,

Yes, I was commenting on the difference in culture, but all women are human and respond to the same animalistic cues to attraction, just like men, except in a different way.

Peace,
Arabian

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ummziba
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Quote ummziba Replybullet Posted: 25 June 2005 at 5:32am

Assalamu alaikum,

It would seem that there are many opinions as to what would or would not attract women, what does or does not make a good husband/wife, what kind of person makes the best companion for life.

As an old, married gal, let me put in my two cents.  Over the long haul, kindness trumps all other attributes - no ifs, ands or buts about it.

Good post, brother Israfil.

Peace, ummziba.

Sticks and stones may break my bones, but your words...they break my soul ~
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Israfil
 
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Quote Israfil Replybullet Posted: 25 June 2005 at 10:12am

As'Salaamu Alaikum

Thanks sister Ummziba..Unfortunately Arabian didn't get my point. I take mere examples of the prophet. When the prophet attended to those unaware of Islam did he show the opposite of kindness? No. Did he show the opposite of kindness towards women? No. Unfortunately Arabian you are taking the very few women in your culture and you link them in categorization saying "They take kjindness for weakness" yet a man such as yourself present yourself weak if you give in to those very few.

If a man changes a positive attribute about himself to fit into society then he is a weak man himself. Kindness is not weak. Women who take kindness for weakness is ignorant themselves especially ignorant to the fact that in society, kindness is very much beneficial. On top of that, to say "I stop being kind and caring which allowed my relationships to be more powerful" is not the attitude that evolves a sustain and fulfilling relationship. Power is shared by the couples abilities not by their behavior.

I again reiterate my point of view that Arabian you can only judge base on your own cultural experience but you cannot judge the world. Arabian you also disagreed with, that men shouldn't empathize with women. Do you know what empathize means? You obviously mistook it as being one who initiates something which doesn't allow the woman to offer her problems to her husband, and if you thought this way you are wrong.

What I mean by empathize is to be a supporting tool for a man's wife if she is experiencing problems. I made this in the sense of of marital relationships. If a woman suffers so does her husband. I don't know one relationship where if a woman goes through something her husband doesn't know. Because a woman doesn't offer to share her problems doesn't mean she is shutting the man away. I believe you mistook what I said for something else.

You also disagreed with what I said when I mentioned that 'men must respect all cultures and nationalities and must free themselves from those who are the opposite (of those who respect cultures and nationalities).

How do you disagree? So if your friend was a racist against other cultures does that mean he/she is your friend? Why do you befriend someone who is a racist? Again read my question then respond before you blantantly reject what I said. Again you missed my point when I mentioned "respect cultures and nationalities." So if a man is a passionate racist that makes it alright? Or if a man hates Jews he should do so with passion? Or a man should only separate himself if the other is opposing Islamic values. Come On Guys we cannot sound hypocritical here.

A true Muslim respect all cultures and nationalities and religions, as he/she is rightly guided by God. If a muslim witnesses truth he/she does not need to conduct themselves negatively towards other religious beliefs just because he/she belives that they are rightly guided. In fact to act KIND towards others of different faiths can actually be beacon for other Muslims to follow which perhaps in the future will lead people to ISLAM.

Again Arabian read what I mean from now on before you respond because you totally missed my point.

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