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Interfaith Dialogue
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Message Icon Topic: ADEENUL AQL RELIGION IS INTELLECT . Post Reply Post New Topic
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minuteman
 
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Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 6:31am
 
 Segregation is necessary. There is no need to mix up the unrelated persons of opposite sex. The result will be what is now available in Europe. WE Muslims do not need to provide any better proof of such things. There is definite attraction between persons of opposite sex. At times there is urge (desire).
 
 Women feel more comfortable when working with other women. Plus and minus terminals should be kept away or reasonably insulated from each other.
If any one is bad some one must suffer
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Angel
 
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Quote Angel Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 7:28am
Originally posted by Nur_Ilahi

The prophets even in your bible prostrate to God when they do their prayers, but not Christians nowadays. This confirms that Christians contradicts the teachings of Bible teachings.
 
Christians do prostrate, along with all the standing and singing, there is much kneeling heads down and hands put together with the fingers facing up to the heavens. You can even just stand with your hands together and the head slightly down and say a prayer. This is also prostrating.  
~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 3:59pm
I suppose this looked like a rhetorical question when I asked it, but I would really be curious to know how Muslims would answer it:
 
Originally posted by Ron Webb

Why on earth do you think He created you with the capacity to enjoy music, art, literature, dance, and so on?
 
And you can add sexual attraction to that list if you want.  Quite apart from the actual act of procreation, why did God make men and women with the capacity to enjoy one another's appearance, companionship, etc., if not as a gift for us to appreciate?
Addeenul Aql Religion is intellect.
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Israfil
 
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Quote Israfil Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 5:50pm
Ron Webb perhaps I can answer that.
 
This is pure off my own intellect so if you're looking for documented Islamic source then I suggest asking one of the members who have a source handy. In such an inquiry I'm more of an Averrorist when it comes to faculties of man. Averroes (Ibn Rushd) took the position that man with all his flaws and limited qualities is capable of prophetic revelation (any human being). We all possess so-called "divine qualities" that enable us to communicate directly to God. According to Averroes it is by God's divine whether or not he activates this divine mechanism in our intellect-in contemporary thought we call this being chosen.
 
I believe more conservative Muslims are using religion as a tool to constrict masses to absolve from activities that they see as emulating no-muslims. Indulging in music and the arts is one of them. I've heard audio lectures from Sheikhs from Saudi Arabia, Egypt and other Muslim dominated countries where they speak out against music, the arts the sciences and so forth. I began to ask myself "why would so-called scholars who, speak their lives studying a focused discipline would condemn other cultural areas they themselves don't know about?" Such questions beg answers.
 
I don't know if God "loves" music as I take the position of Moses Maimonides in believing that God is beyond our desires adn has left those to us. I believe God gave human beings a variety of qualities so that we not only have the full experience of being human, but it is also apart of our intellect so that we have some sort of self-identification. We know ourselves through our interaction in the world that means, music, the arts, sciences etc. I believe God gave us sexual desires so that we would procreate and replenish the human popultion.
 
The mechanisms that promote lust in our biological makeup is apart of this equation. Although the intent was not to become immoral creatures it was as I already mentioned, for the purpose of procreation and as well as developing (or solidfying) a relationship with the other person. When religions define morality within their own scope of understanding you'll always have restrictions and this is not always a bad thing. Humans although the most intelligent creatures on the planet still need guidance. Even if you are areligious human beings still need guidance throughout their life whether its guidance in school, work, sports, or life. We sometimes need constraint because it is easy to become side tracked. But at the same time there must be a balance in how much constraint.
I believe all those qualities of a human being should be enjoyed to their fullest extent because that is where we enjoy our humanity however there must also be a balance to that enjoyment.
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Merigen
 
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Quote Merigen Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 6:19pm
Nur,
 
I wonder why you quoted these, yet you avoid these facts.

Islam teaches that a mans desire/passion/lust starts from the eyes. Men gets easily aroused sexually when seeing a woman especially if the women bare themselves. Some men gets excited sexually when seeing a womans hair, some eye the neck, some love the figure and the bum while most men love to ogle a womans boobs.

On the other hand, a womans desire/passion/lust starts from the touch. In order for men to increase the sexual drive of a woman, the first thing that they do is caressing the bare skin.  

I am not avoiding the above.  It's just that I think much of it is very silly.  Men have the ability to inhibit their actions and they should.  By making them such pathetic babies, you are denying them the opportunity to show they can or should behave properly. 

No bowing goes on but there is a fair amount of standing and singing. The prophets even in your bible prostrate to God when they do their prayers, but not Christians nowadays. This confirms that Christians contradicts the teachings of Bible teachings.

Why would this bother you? You think the Bible is corrupted anyway.
 
I would venture a guess that what you call Islamic teachings are actually some hadith handed down by some guy who was totally preoccupied by sex and puritanical at the same time.  = There speaks an ignorant person. I will repeat again here - Adeenul 'Aql - Religion is intellect. So feed your intellect with knowledge than you will be enlightened.
 
The above is my personal opinion.  From what I see and read, why would you expect anything different?  I worked once with a very nice Muslim man.  We spoke one day about he and his wife returning to their native land of Pakistan for a visit.  He mentioned that she would be wearing hijab during the visit.  He laughed when I interjected that it seemed that the purpose of the clothing was due to men being weak.  He laughed and said, "yes we are very weak."
 
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Quote Merigen Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 6:49pm
Minuteman,
 
Segregation is necessary. There is no need to mix up the unrelated persons of opposite sex. The result will be what is now available in Europe. WE Muslims do not need to provide any better proof of such things. There is definite attraction between persons of opposite sex. At times there is urge (desire).
 
 Women feel more comfortable when working with other women. Plus and minus terminals should be kept away or reasonably insulated from each other.
 
Where do you live?  I think it would be pretty impractical to segregate people at work.  To make light of the situation I ask, why would you get involved with someone you work with when you have so many daily problems to begin with?  I actually do work with women only in the department I am assigned to but I see men daily - "Hey!  Are you?  How's your wife and kids?  How is school?  How's your girlfriend?,  How's your new dog or cat?, etc."  If the person in the cubicle next to me was male, it wouldn't make a bit of difference.
 
I'm sure you already read my post about church.  As I said there's no hanky-panky going on there.  We all enjoy philosophical conversation with each other and more mundane doings such as - who brought the treats for coffee hour today??   After church we all go our separate ways. 
 
I'm not exactly sure what's available in Europe these days.  My best friend and her husband have been going there for three years now and have done alot of sight seeing and eating in wonderful restaurants. 
 
I do take public transportation everyday and that's not segregated either.  No problems except for the occasional drunk in the evenings. 
 
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Quote Merigen Replybullet Posted: 16 June 2008 at 6:55pm

Hello Israfil,

I liked your post to Ron Webb expecially because it was off the top of your head and not from a documented Islamic source.  I'll read more about the information you gave.  Thank you!

Merigen

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Quote believer Replybullet Posted: 17 June 2008 at 8:08am
Many Christians during prayer hold hands- men and women, children young and old, friends and family memebers holding hands praying together.
 
It is very strong and moving, 1 people together talking to GOD.
 
You are no more then an animal if you can not control your lust!!
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
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