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Islam for non-Muslims
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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 04 June 2008 at 4:28pm
I agree, it might work very well for some individuals.  I just don't think that on the whole it is good for society, especially if it is slanted in one direction only (i.e., multiple wives but not multiple husbands).  I don't think it should be forbidden, but it probably should be discouraged.
Addeenul ‘Aql – Religion is intellect.
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Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 04 June 2008 at 8:11pm
 
 Ron, that is no reply, i.e. might and probably... If it is the question of polygamy then it has been in practice for ages. We read that king david had a few wives. King Soloman had 300 wives and 1000 concubines. That is all according to the bible, nothing is there about that in the Quran.
 
 Even prophet Jacob had two wives. So please tell us which way you are heading. Are you questioning the very old senior great persons?? That they were wrong and they were at fault and you are a better thinker?? I do not see that you can say anything against the system of multi marriage of Islam in the case of need/ necessity.
 
 I have read the bible Isaiah ch.4 verses 1-3 in which the prophet Isaiah had predicted about polygamy as follows:
 
Isaiah 4

 1 In that day seven women
       will take hold of one man
       and say, "We will eat our own food
       and provide our own clothes;
       only let us be called by your name.
       Take away our disgrace!"

The Branch of the Lord
 2 In that day the Branch of the LORD will be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the land will be the pride and glory of the survivors in Israel. 3 Those who are left in Zion, who remain in Jerusalem, will be called holy, all who are recorded among the living in Jerusalem.
 
(Please note that Jerusalem and Zion are only symbolic. It is not necessary that it be the two cities/places)
 That was a clear indication of the time of the prophet Muhammad when there will be wars against the infidels (enemies of Peace) and many men pious men will lay their lives in the cause of truth. There will become serious shortage  of young men and some ladies will become widows.
 
 The prophet will order men to marry more than one woman so as to uproot any dismay or corruption in the society. Please read the frst line of the chapter above.


Edited by minuteman - 04 June 2008 at 8:14pm
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Saladin
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Quote Saladin Replybullet Posted: 06 June 2008 at 2:12am

 Islam did not invent polygamy. Islam only regulated an already existing practice of every nation and culture. Neither does Islam make a muslim polygamous. There are many more muslim men strictly faithful to their only wives than people who are supposedly monogamous but are just polygamous without the label. Man's polygamous nature is a fact and polygamy as in Islam is only the alternative to an otherwise adulterous society with its ills.

'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Quote minuteman Replybullet Posted: 06 June 2008 at 3:28am
 That is right. Islam only regulated the matter, as in the case of slavery, Islam regulated the bad practice in such a way so that there would be no slaves in the end.
 
 About polygamy, it was the practice in general without any limit or any rules. Islam regulated it to limit it to a maximum of four wives at a time and with many conditions of equal treatment etc. Also Islam advised that only one wife was better. That sentence is an important part of the quran. It is recommending that only one wife is better. What else could we need?
 
 There are certain times when it is cruel to throw of a  lady  for any reason of her illness. The second marriage becomes necessary.  otherwise the whole life becomes miserable. Wise wives allow such things and one of those wise wives was Hazrat Sarah, the wife of Hazrat Abraham a.s.
 
 There is no need to argue and question the wisdom behind the Quranic injunctions. The Jews and the christians have to thank the Islamic system. Otherwise, if there was strict monogamy in practice then there would have been no Jews are christians.


Edited by minuteman - 06 June 2008 at 3:31am
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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 06 June 2008 at 4:07pm
Originally posted by minuteman

There is no need to argue and question the wisdom behind the Quranic injunctions. The Jews and the christians have to thank the Islamic system. Otherwise, if there was strict monogamy in practice then there would have been no Jews are christians.
 
Sorry, minuteman, I don't understand.  Why would there have been no Jews [or?] Christians?
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honeto
 
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Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 06 June 2008 at 5:49pm
Originally posted by Ron Webb

Originally posted by honeto

Mystical I will have to realistically disgree with that. I agree that a woman in normal circumtances will not agree to share her husband, but a true believer woman probably won't be as blunt if a unusual situation arises when its not a matter of man's benefit but purely for the benefit of the woman and the society. That unusual situation can be after a war and loss of a lot of men, leaving childless widows or those woman with children who are still young. Then it may be not about sharing the man but about helping and giving hope to those who otherwise would have none.
Right in our lifetime, right here on this earth in many regional crises such a situation has arised where big number of men are lost to conflicts.

Would the same apply in reverse?  For instance, India and China, through selective abortion, are both creating lopsided societies with a severe shortage of women.  Do you think women should be allowed to have multiple husbands in such a circumstance?  Would the men be as willing to share their woman, "giving hope to those who otherwise would have none"?

 
Ron,
the answer is simple, selective abortion is un-Islamic, so this sort of population imbalance would not happen in an Islamic soceity.
As far as the matter of a woman having more than one husband at a time, I don't have much knowledge about it. I will say however, that it seams impratical since man has a leadership role for his family in Islam and in Judeo-christian teachings. Thus, besides many other compilications, there cannot be two learders under one roof! I do not see such complications (though not easy probably) in case of a man having more than one wife in many examples not just in Islam, but in the Judeo-Christian practices according to the "Bible".
Hasan
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
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Ron Webb
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Quote Ron Webb Replybullet Posted: 06 June 2008 at 8:19pm

Originally posted by honeto

Ron,
the answer is simple, selective abortion is un-Islamic, so this sort of population imbalance would not happen in an Islamic soceity.

Gender imbalances can arise in many ways. You suggested that a shortage of men could arise in a society at war, because a great many (male) soldiers are killed.  Let us suppose instead that the enemy is intent on exterminating the entire race, and specifically targets women of reproductive age (perhaps through some kind of biological weapon).

So, the question remains: Do you think women should be allowed to have multiple husbands in such a circumstance?  Would the men be as willing to share their woman, "giving hope to those who otherwise would have none"?

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Quote Chrysalis Replybullet Posted: 07 June 2008 at 3:36am
Originally posted by Ron Webb

Originally posted by honeto

Ron,
the answer is simple, selective abortion is un-Islamic, so this sort of population imbalance would not happen in an Islamic soceity.

Gender imbalances can arise in many ways. You suggested that a shortage of men could arise in a society at war, because a great many (male) soldiers are killed.  Let us suppose instead that the enemy is intent on exterminating the entire race, and specifically targets women of reproductive age (perhaps through some kind of biological weapon).

So, the question remains: Do you think women should be allowed to have multiple husbands in such a circumstance?  Would the men be as willing to share their woman, "giving hope to those who otherwise would have none"?

 
There are several loopholes in Polyandry . . . and it is unnatural, which is why Islam does not allow it:
 
1. First of all, the situation you have outlined is highly unlikely. True, as technology advances, only men will not get killed. . . rather, BOTH genders will get killed i.e mass destruction. In this case, the solution is Polygamy to repopulate the society.
 
2- The situation u mentioned above is only likely in a Hollywood movie. However, EVEN if that happens. . .too bad for the Men. Polyandry can have adverse affects which is why it is not permissable in Islam.
 
3- A man having multiple wives, can help propogate the society in terms of population . . . a Female having mutiple husbands (Polyandry) cannot do that. Which is one of the reasons Polyandry isnt ideal. I'm not saying that She cannot have kids . . .but in a population crisis, A polygamous marriage is more advantageous, compared to Monogamy. And Polyandry doesnt help the situation.
 
4- Of the several things wrong with Polyandry is the issue of the Fathering of the child. Which husband is responsible for the baby? We only have DNA tech NOW. Islam is for the past as well as the present. It would be unfair to disallow Polyandry in the past and allow it now just bcz we hav DNA tech. Besides, it will not be widley available for some time yet.
 
5- During Polygamy, if the woman is indisposed, sick, not feeling well, pregnant or not upto it, the other partner does not suffer. The husband can have relations with his other wife, and the indisposed wife can take time off guilt-free. In the case of Polyandry . . . If the Wife is indisposed . . .multiple ppl will suffer i.e ALL her husbands.
 
6. You may call life unfair or whatever, but this is the reality of things. Most males have a higher sex-drive compared to females... a female in a Polyandrous marriage will not be able to keep up with mutiple sexual partners on a normal basis. Atleast one of the partners will have to give up his 'turn' or right for the other. Women in Polygynous marriages however do not have to suffer sexually.
 
7. Again, you may call life unfair . . . but Women with multiple sex partners are more likley to catch veneral diseases compared to Men with multiple sex-partners. Thats how God made us. . .like it ir not, that is the reality.
 
8. Men may find it easier to cope with the emotional demands of more than one woman. But woman, who are prone to varying emotional needs due to the presence of Oestrogen have thier 'times' when they need space . . .and during these times cannot possibly cater to the emotional/whatver issues/needs of mutlple partners. During thier emotional times, they find one husband difficult enough to cope with :p Men howver, since do not go thru any hormonal surges, can find themselves emotionally available to care for thier wards/wives throughout the month/lifetime. Atleast more than when compared to women.
 
9. Men are sexually/reproductivley active throughout most of thier lives. That again, is a fact/reality. As they grow older, thier wives dont have to suffer sexually or otherwise (most of the times). That is not the case with Polyandry. Women go thru menopause and thier libido diminishes with age. What then becomes of the multiple male partners after menopause? Especially since they still have thier needs. I dont think all of them will be nice enough to stick around.
 
All that and more are the reasons Polyandry is impractical, unrealistic and just a fantasy.
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