You believe what you are going to believe.  I think you and I have talked this out all that we need to, so this will be my last word on it.  Language barriers.

"Jesus was quite clear in His words that the Holy Spirit would come to His disciples."

Muhammad could not, would not, and did not, come to Jesus disciples.

Deuteronomy - the Lord was speaking to Moses when He said

¹⁴ For these nations, which thou shalt possess

the land which the Israelites were going in to possess

¹⁵ The Lord thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me

He was speaking to the Israelites when He said it.  "like unto me" - like Moses.  Moses did the miracles of God.

²⁰ But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

Muhammad died.

Judge for yourself.
I know what I believe.
You know what you believe.
Peace.



Edited by Caringheart - 16 July 2012 at 8:49pm

Greetings Ismail,

No, I am sorry but I do not agree, knowing as I do the english language I am sure better than you can understand it. 
The pronoun 'he' means nothing.

It is quite clear that the Comforter God was sending was the Spirit of Himself (God) after His Son (Jesus) was to depart from His disciples, to continue to guide and strengthen them in sharing the Word of God.

and I can truly say that I am guided, and comforted, by the Holy Spirit in my life.

Caringheart,
by God, and I am fasting, my intention is certainly not to confuse rather to show you the truth that is clear to me as the light of the day is. All I am trying is to convey that to you.
When I said that the Holy spirit was with them, I did not make it up. According to the Bible the Holy Spirit was with Jesus and his disciples, plus others before, here is the proof:
Luke 1:41
When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.

Acts 4:8
Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them: “Rulers and elders of the people!
Luke 3:22
and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: “You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased.”

Luke 4:1
[ Jesus Is Tested in the Wilderness ] Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, left the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness,

Luke 10:21
At that time Jesus, full of joy through the Holy Spirit, said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this is what you were pleased to do.

Acts 10:38
how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.

So my dear friend, I have shown you with the above verses not my words that Holy Spirit was present with them before according to the Bible.
And that "another" does not mean "same" what they already had and knew.

Hasan

Edited by honeto - 28 July 2012 at 12:30pm

Hasan,

   The Holy Spirit is always present since God is always present, they are one.

   You quoted Luke 1:41, "When Elizabeth (the mother of John the Baptist, with whom she was six months pregnant), heard mary's greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit."

   What you quoted is the proof of the Trinity. Mary had been visited by the angel, Gabriel, and told that she would bear a holy child;

   "Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. And behold, you will bring forth a Son, and shall call His name Jesus. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord will give Him the throne of His father David. And He will reign over the house of Jacob FOREVER, and of His KINGDOM there will be NO END."

   When Elizabeth heard Mary's voice her child leaped in her womb in acknowlegement of the presence of Jesus who was in Mary's womb.

   Elizabeth said; "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb!" But why is this granted to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For indeed, as soon as the voice of your greeting sounded in my ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy."

   It was this same child, John the Baptist, who later recognized Jesus as the True Christ, the promised Messiah of the Jews. When John saw Jesus coming toward him to be baptized, John said;

   "Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world."

   Mark 1:9-11,

   9. It came to pass in those days that Jesus came from Nazareh of Galilee, and was baptized by John in the Jordan."
   10. And immediately, coming up from the water, He saw the heavens parting and the Spirit descending on Him like a dove.
   11. Then a voice came from heaven, "You are My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.""

   So, you see, God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit were all present at Jesus' baptism. God Himself refers to Jesus as His "beloved Son" after God's Holy Spirit had descended upon Jesus Christ.

   These things show that the Holy Spirit is part of God Himself, just as the New Testament shows that Jesus Christ was also of God Himself. And John recognized Jesus as "The Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world." Only God has the power to take away the sins of mortal men. And these passages show that.

   That was the reason for Jesus Christ to come into the world, that through the sacrifice of His own life, He could offer salvation for mankind, who did not merit salvation on their own merits.

   If, as you believe, Jesus did NOT die and then resurrect on the third day and ascend to God in heaven, what was the purpose of Jesus Christ in the world? As a simple prophet? No. There have been many prophets, but there has only been one Son of God who could take away the sins of mankind through faith. Jesus was the Final Sacrifice that made salvation possible.

   After Jesus Christ, no more living animal sacrifices to God were required or needed. There was no point to them after Jesus' own sacrifice through death and resurrection. The sacrificing of living animals is actually offensive to God, since He Himself had sacrified Himself for the sake of mankind. So how could mortal men equate the sacrifice of God Himself with the sacrifice of a mere dumb animal? Talk about insulting God!!!

   And, at the End of the World, Jesus will return to judge the living and the dead. No mere "prophet" could be resurrected to life after His death, and then come back after His death, down from heaven itself, with the power of God to judge all mankind.

   Jesus Christ WAS crucified by the Romans, died, and then resurrected from death and will return at the End of the World.

   There are many prophecies made by the Jewish prophets concerning the Messiah in the Bible, especially by Isaiah, that were fulfilled in every respect by Jesus Christ, because he WAS the Messiah, the Savior of all mankind.

   So you may believe that Jesus was taken up to heaven and Allah provided a "stunt double" to be crucified and die in His place, so that Jesus would not have to go through the "humiliation" and pain of death. But, the sacrifice of the "stunt double" would mean nothing for mankind, what would be the point?

   Jesus knew what His fate was and spoke about it openly to His disciples prior to His crucifixion and death. Jesus Christ was not a mere mortal human "prophet" He was the living Son of God. He even knew who would betray Him. John 13:21'

   "When Jesus had said these things, He was troubled in spirit, and testified and said, "Most assuredly, I say to you, one of you will betray Me."

   He knew it was Judas Iscariot and at the Last Supper, Jesus said to Judas, "What you do, do quickly." And then Judas left. The prophets of the Old Testament had even predicted the amount of money that Judas would get from the Temple authorities for betraying Jesus, 30 pieces of silver. How would they know that? Because they are true prophets of God. They even prophsied that none of His bones will be broken." Romans broke the legs of crucified people to hasten their death or prove that they were dead, it was a standard procedure in crucifixion. The robbers on either side of Jesus had their legs broken, but they did not do it to Jesus.

   How many other "prophets" do you know of who come back from the dead, ascend to heaven, and then return at the End of the World to judge the world with the awesome powerpower of God Himself?

   Muhammad is still dead, as all other mortal humans are, or will be someday.

Larry


Edited by Larry - 28 July 2012 at 11:47pm