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Interfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Interfaith Dialogue
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believer
 
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Quote believer Replybullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 4:28pm
Seems that not all Muslims agree on the definitions, but that is OK. 
 
Yes I did above - honeto - Our ministers go through years of college learning all the languages of the Old and New Testament.  They translate the Bible on their own- interesting that all come up with the basic idea that God gave us a savior in Jesus Christ.
 
Here is what I wonder- We know that Jesus is the Son of GOD, how can He then be God the Father?  We know that the manifestation of GOD as Jesus follows the will of the Father.  The Counsellor is the Holy Spirit and Jesus was all about turning the other cheek and loving your enemy.
 
This verse is talking about the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
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Shasta'sAunt
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Quote Shasta'sAunt Replybullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 4:45pm
"John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
 
But shouldn't that read that God so loved the world He gave Himself....  


Edited by Shasta'sAunt - 16 April 2008 at 4:45pm
“No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.”
Eleanor Roosevelt
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Quote believer Replybullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 5:25pm
LOL!!  Now wouldn't that really confuse the Non-Christians!!
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
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Servetus
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Quote Servetus Replybullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 5:58pm

There was no need for me to write after you had understood and appreciated the reply from Shasta'sAunt.

 

On the contrary, Minuteman.  I always appreciate your contributions and, as importantly, your peaceful style.  Thank you for seconding the thought.

 

Best regards,

 

Serv

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Quote robin Replybullet Posted: 05 June 2008 at 1:09am
Originally posted by Shasta'sAunt

Believer:

Here are the correct translation of these verses. The Word was Be, and Jesus was. This is explaining how Mary, a virgin, could be with child. Allah(SWT) said Be, and Jesus was.

Messiah can be a deliverer, such as the Jews were awaiting, or a leader and teacher, but Muslims do not call Jesus a messiah. He is a Prophet and an Apostle of God.

3:45 Behold! the angels said: "O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah.

4:171 O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His apostles. Say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah. Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs.

 
Christ and Messiah mean exactly the same thing!
 
 
"Christ" is the Greek word for anointed.
 
"Christ  —n. 1 title, also now treated as a name, given to Jesus. 2 Messiah as prophesied in the Old Testament. —int. slang expressing surprise, anger, etc. [Greek, = anointed]."-Qxford Dictionary
 
 
 
"Messiah" is the Hebrew word for anointed.
 
"Messiah  n. 1  a promised deliverer of the Jews. b Christ regarded as this. 2 liberator of an oppressed people. [Hebrew, = anointed]."-Oxford Dictionary
 
 
 
So in both instances the Quran admits that Jesus in the promised One from God.
 
 
 

JESUS AS “CHRIST" IN THE QUR’AN

 

Su 3:45  Behold! The angels said: "O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: His name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honor in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah;"

 

Su 4:157  That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Apostle of Allah"; --But they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not: --

 

Su 4:171  O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a Spirit proceeding from Him: So believe in Allah and His apostles. Say not "Trinity": desist: It will be better for you: For Allah is One God: Glory be to Him: (Far Exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs.

 

Su 4:172¶  Section 24. Christ disdaineth not to serve and worship Allah, nor do the angels, those nearest (to Allah): Those who disdain His worship and are arrogant, --He will gather them all together unto Himself to (answer).

 

Su 5:19  In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ the son of Mary. Say "Who then hath the least power against Allah, if His Will were to destroy Christ the son of Mary, his mother, and all--every one that is on the earth? For to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that is between. He createth what He pleaseth. For Allah hath power over all things."

 

Su 5:75  They do blaspheme who say: "Allah is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord" Whoever joins other gods with Allah, --Allah will forbid him the Garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrongdoers be no one to help.

 

Su 5:78  Christ the son of Mary was no more than an Apostle; many were the apostles that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. See how Allah doth make His Signs clear to them; yet see in what ways they are deluded away from the truth!

 

Su 9:30  Section 5. The Jews call Uzair (Ezra) a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the Son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (In this) they imitate what the Unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: How they are deluded away from the Truth!

 

Su 9:31  They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; Yet they were commanded to worship but One God: There is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).

 

Jesus admits He IS The “Messiah”:-

 

John 4:25-26

"The woman said to him: “I know that Messiah (Greek text reads “Messias.”) is coming, who is called Christ (Greek text reads “Christos.”). Whenever that one arrives, he will declare all things to us openly.” 26 Jesus said to her: “I who am speaking to you am he.”"

 

 

 



Edited by robin - 05 June 2008 at 5:03am
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Quote robin Replybullet Posted: 05 June 2008 at 1:31am
Originally posted by Shasta'sAunt

"John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
 
But shouldn't that read that God so loved the world He gave Himself....  
 
No because Jesus is NOT God!
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Quote honeto Replybullet Posted: 29 September 2008 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by believer

Seems that not all Muslims agree on the definitions, but that is OK. 
 
Yes I did above - honeto - Our ministers go through years of college learning all the languages of the Old and New Testament.  They translate the Bible on their own- interesting that all come up with the basic idea that God gave us a savior in Jesus Christ.
 
Here is what I wonder- We know that Jesus is the Son of GOD, how can He then be God the Father?  We know that the manifestation of GOD as Jesus follows the will of the Father.  The Counsellor is the Holy Spirit and Jesus was all about turning the other cheek and loving your enemy.
 
This verse is talking about the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
 
your reply reminds me the scrembled eggs I ate the other day.  My friend you still are unable to address my hard work's finding. How did this quote got messed up in understanding from being a message in the hands of Jews to the Christians. Here is that example again, a true example of how people translate/alter/or adopt things that fulfil their purpose and agenda.
I will quote a verse from Jewish Bible (translation form Chabad.org, and the same verse from Christian Bible. I could not believe how Chrisitian altered this to preach their doctrine.

Isaiah 9:6 (New King James Version)

      For unto us a Child is born,
      Unto us a Son is given;
      And the government will be upon His shoulder.
      
And His name will be called
      Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
      Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace
.
 
Now look at the Jewish Bible, the same verse appears one number back in the the same book (Isaiah9:5) but it is its contents that are very important and different in meaning then the Christian version.
 
"For a child has been born to us, a son given to us, and the authority is upon his shoulder, and the wondrous adviser, the mighty God, the everlasting Father, called his name, "the prince of peace."
 
There is not the same understanding here as you derive from your interpretation of the same.
 
Hasan


Edited by honeto - 29 September 2008 at 4:59pm
39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"
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Quote believer Replybullet Posted: 29 September 2008 at 6:46pm

Do you only take literal understandings from prophecy?  Do you read the Quran only literally?

We do call Jesus Emmanuel.  It is the prediction of the fact that we call Jesus Emmanuel.  Are you thinking that Mary should have called Jesus all these names?  LOL!  Can you imagine Mary calling Him home as a young boy for supper?
 
Yes I have already mentioned to you - it is another interpretation of the Holy Scripture.
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
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