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Message Icon Topic: Whose the Terrorist Muslim or Christian? Post Reply Post New Topic
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Chelle
 
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Quote Chelle Replybullet Posted: 25 December 2007 at 3:58pm
No, Oscar, you're not.
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Israfil
 
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Quote Israfil Replybullet Posted: 25 December 2007 at 7:07pm

Anatolian you said:

"Israfil, I completly agree with you and that humanities brutality surpasses
religion. But we do not see any brutality within Christianity these days as we
see in Islam."

If you agree with me completely this comment above would be unnecessary. "We" don't see anything that implicates Islam as a brutal religion, but if we can find anything that would implicate the culprit, we would see that those who take religion excessively as oppose to the general populace are at high risk becoming fanatical. I feel like I'm repeating myself.

Martha you said:

I think the point Anatolian was trying to convey is that wars such as Iraq are not based on religion ie Christianity

How do you know?

From face value it may not look that way but you never know.

 

 

 

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martha
 
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Quote martha Replybullet Posted: 26 December 2007 at 4:07am
martha wrote:

 It is invariably the Christians who paid and made it possible for them to have prosthetic limbs and counselling and  money is given in its millions to repair damage done to all war riddled countries. 

 

 

Oscar you asked me:-

was it not the same Christians that were responsible for blowing them up, and then you want to show the Muslims how compassionate you are for helping them.

the logic some people use is crazy.

 Oscar, yes it is the same Christians that were responsible, that then helped the innocent mend their lives. It is not the fault of the innocent that their countries leaders are corrupt and bad. It is logical to help the ones that suffer then isnt it?  Or would you suggest otherwise?

Israfil, if you read my words correctly:-

I think the point Anatolian was trying to convey is that wars such as Iraq are not based on religion ie Christianity

What is your question exactly, do you want me to answer for Anatolians' view or mine? My view is obvious. I dont believe that wars started by Christians are done so for the sake of CHristianity. How do I know? No more than you know the answer, brother. None of us know the intentions in the hearts of others. We can only go by the facts that face us. You should know by now that I am muslim. I am not defending Christianity, but I will defend any person of any faith if they deserve it. That is my right to do so. It is personal to me. My choice.

But many muslims have much to answer for too. Dont neglect this in your attack on CHristianity. I will insult no religion, I have said this time over. It serves no purpose other than giving us all something to have a chat about. We must look at all angles to be able to understand what makes people 'tick'. One thing that sticks in my mind is how can Sadam Hussein offer five times a day prayer and then persecute his people. Where is the logic in that? Do I defend this type of person? Of course I do not. But let me make it clear, to everyone. I am not disrespecting Islam just because I dont respect the man. So dont try to even point this out to me. My question to you then is why should I try to be a good muslim? Does not me being a follower of Islam put me in the same league as Sadam? No, of course it doesnt. It is no different to  Christian people trying to do good when leaders such as Bush, Blair and Mush do idiotic acts. Never match the religion to a persons deeds. It is totally illogical.

some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set
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Israfil
 
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Quote Israfil Replybullet Posted: 26 December 2007 at 8:37am

Martha, calm down it was only a question...... Why are you so hostile?

The fact that you believe wars are not started on the religious factor is your belief which I respect. However with me, I believe wars are started by many variables and I believe beliefs whether religious or not, are one of them. You ask how can Saddam pray five times a day and persecute his people? Again, how do we know he prays five times a day? Does television implicates these facts? Books? But for argument's sake let us assume that he did pray five times a day. Most vile leaders in their mind have  a totally different conscious than other humans. In their mind, their lack of conscious in turn distorts the outside world and they believe as if what they do is the right thing when unanimously their actions are considered wrong by the world.

Hitler had an idea of a pure race and would exterminate other humans for this idea and in his mind he thought this was the right plan. Many fanatics regardless of religion use this tatic to control the ignorant masses.

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Quote ops154 Replybullet Posted: 26 December 2007 at 10:38am
Originally posted by OSCAR

i am defiantly not demonizing Christianity, my question is very simple why are openly committed Christian leaders (bush Blair) and their majority Christian populations taken part in murder and to this day done nothing to stop Innocent Muslim civilians deaths, or admit their behavior was immoral according to the bible, or do they still think they were right to do so like in a recent TV interview with Blair.

if the Christian west cant even see what they did was wrong what bible have they been reading. is there a verse in the bible that says create lies about a another nation and there religion and then bomb them until they accept democracy    

Our country is not run by the bible, or at least it is not supposed to be. Religion and politics should and are supposed to be separated. Hopefully after Bush leaves office we will get back to this thinking but I'm not holding my breath.

As far as the civilians go, we don't target them on purpose. I know many here don't believe that but it is the truth. On the other hand, Muslims routinely target areas with lots of civilians to inflict as much damage and death as they can. We on the other hand actually limit our use. That is why we can blow up a building and leave the one next to it standing. Now of course we will never be able to prevent all of them but we do try. I know some people talk about us dropping a bomb on wedding parties and such but come on, when you fire weapons at a wedding in the middle of a war zone you should count on a chance of being fired back on. On the other hand, how many times do we hear about a bomb going on in a packed market and then another one just as the emergency help starts to arrive? There is no other purpose other than to kill civilians and that is done by people who like to scream "In the name of Allah" just before they pull the trigger. Also, these statistics of civilian deaths, are they listed out as to who killed them? Were they killed by sectarian violence, were they in the same building as someone who was shooting at our troops? All of this needs to be considered in my opinion. I know if America didn't invade Afghanistan or Iraq then the number would be a lot lower because the Taliban and Hussan didn't kill this many this fast but not all of the civilian deaths were caused by American bullets.

 

Get it through your heads that I don't support Bush or the Israeli's! Thank your lucky stars for America is here to stay!!!
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Quote OSCAR Replybullet Posted: 26 December 2007 at 10:45am

the vast majority of Muslims do not blame the average Christian in the street for what other Christians have done or are doing.

however ask Muslims living in the west how they and there religion has been demonised when Muslims do wrong, George bush and the "Civilized world"

you say that those Muslims did it in the name of Islam, but Tony Blair now a Catholic convert said that he asked for Gods guidance before be started the war.

whats the difference

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martha
 
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Quote martha Replybullet Posted: 26 December 2007 at 11:32am

Israfil, I am not a hostile person, so sorry you felt this. All of us get on our soap box from time to time, you included brother. I guess it was my turn to be something other than the 'pobre martha' that whisper has decided I am. So allow me this occasionally.

There will always be tyrants. We will never stop that.

Hitler, had he succeeded in his quest to ultimately control the whole world, would have made it virtually impossible for us to have any kind of freedom.  Sadam received the punishment he also deserved .

Oscar pointed out that Blair, before he was a Catholic, asked God for guidance before starting the war. We only have Blairs word for that. And Blair didnt say what Gods/Allahs reply was. Is he saving that to put in his updated memoirs? And why do we think Blair will listen to God when he didnt listen to the British people who told him not to invade Iraq? Blair, who was voted into office by the people,ultimately failed the people, and as such he failed God. Harsh words maybe.

 

 

some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set
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nu001
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Quote nu001 Replybullet Posted: 27 December 2007 at 12:19am

It is the christians who are waging all the wars. in the last century and this century including Iraq and Afghanistan. I would be happy if the christians did it under christianity, rathar they are doing it for money, power etc materialistic gains. On the other hand the muslims who are fighting these christians are doing it in self defence in the name of religion.

The religion who have largest practicing followers is Islam. So it will always look like this, as most of the muslims will not abandon religion as others did. If the christians would follow the religion of bible most of these wars wouldn't have happened.

"Al-Quran-The only Straight path to success. Alhamdulillah"
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