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Islamic INTRAfaith Dialogue
 IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum : Religion - Islam : Islamic INTRAfaith Dialogue
Message Icon Topic: Saudi Female can fly but not drive Post Reply Post New Topic
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mariyah
 
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Quote mariyah Replybullet Posted: 12 June 2008 at 8:12pm
Originally posted by Saladin

 Sometime back I read in a newspaper that a woman saved the life of her husband, who suffered a heart attack while he was driving, by driving the car herself to the hospital. It came to be known later that the man taught his wife to drive, in private. Turned out to be a wise decision. 
 
 The whole idea of preventing women from driving supposedly to prevent them from corruption, is laughable. I mean having an unrelated driver or public transport can be more corrupting and as if only women are prone to sinning and as if driving tempts women to sin. It would make sense if they allow woman to drive but with an adult male relative for support and security, like in case of accidents or flat tyres.
 
 
 
 
 
Asalaamu alaikum,
I have changed tyres quite well in the past by myself, LOL thank you when I have had no choice.
I often travel 90 miles each way to work 2 days a week in the southern US. I would rather change my own tyres than risk molestation from a strange male.
If you think I am a fool, then do so. I also financially support my husband, mother-in law, my disabled son so I do so.
I just happen to have the job skills and education. My husbands works as the local Islamic center in the small pueblo we live near and his work is voluntary and he makes enough at the local farmers market on the weekend to feed us. My son is maintaining my home in the southern az city I live in, I pay the taxes on the home and maintain my utilities,(I own the home, I had it before I married my husband and it is paid for)  he feeds himself on his small disability pension (he is one of the Afghanistan veterans that the government ignores)
You may knock the US, but we can live here more Islamically than we could in Saudi Arabia!
The Qur'an gurantees a woman her own property.
Allah subanallah Wa taa'la provides all, Insha'Allah we will remain safe!


Edited by mariyah - 12 June 2008 at 8:15pm
"Every good deed is charity whether you come to your brother's assistance or just greet him with a smile.
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Saladin
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Quote Saladin Replybullet Posted: 13 June 2008 at 2:31am

 Agree with all what was written above, it's funny when people from outside our country speaks on behalf of our people, and i find it funny and sad at the same time Saudi Arabia gets so much mention, i mean i have never read someone writting something like:
this arabic or islamic country legalises prostitution, or allows the opening of bars and people posting how sad such things can happen, or the fact that a woman can not wear a niqab in Tunis, no!
but i guess those things are ok!!!
Subhan Allah.

 Salaam brother,

 I undertand your frustration at your country being targeted for criticism, sometimes falsely but i dont think Saudi gets anymore than the US or China get. Reason is that Saudi is the birthplace of Islam and there's always going to be attention. When you get something wrong, for some motivated along religious, sectarian and racist lines, its a chance to get a shot at you. Some criticize coz it may be against their standards of rights and equality. For some, me included, wanting to see Saudi as the ideal Islamic state, do it because we perceive your mistakes as not befitting the ideal Islamic state. That said i dont think anyone else is any better or holier than the Saudis. Brother, i've heard and read of some amazingly good things about Saudi and its people, by people, muslims and non muslims who have lived there, for which i could find no parallel anywhere else. Sadly these dont make it to mainstream news.
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Quote Hamzah Replybullet Posted: 13 June 2008 at 3:07am
Jazak Allah khair brother Saladin for a well put and fair post, we do have our flaws as a nation i will admit that but most of it have to do with the system rather than the individuals, take the ban on women driving for example, most Saudi people are against the ban, you have your mother, wife, sisters and daughters to fit into you schedual every day, from shopping to social gatherings, me and my brothers have to take them everywhere and you know what! i think they enjoy using us as their Chauffeurs , trust me we don't enjoy it, we are not a comunity of angels but we are not as bad as the media make us out to be.

Note: a few months back a dutch site asked if the women should be allowed to drive, more than 70% said no, i'm sure most were men
i guess they havent thought about it deeply, from 1st hand experience, it's a nightmare.
"Whosoever fears Allah, he will appoint for him a way out, and provide for him from where he does not expect"
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Quote Hamzah Replybullet Posted: 13 June 2008 at 3:34am
Sister Maryiah you wrote:

You may knock the US, but we can live here more Islamically than we could in Saudi Arabia!
The Qur'an gurantees a woman her own property


Have you been to Saudi Arabia to pass such judgment, my wife is a German revert, she defends Saudi Arabia to the bone because she has seen first hand that the way Saudi Arabia is portryaed in the west is anything but the truth, and why do think that women don't own property in Saudi Arabia?
i agree about living in the states being a better option for you with regards to your situation, ma sha Allah sister, we are really proud of you, may Allah give you power and reward in this life and the life after, but apart from the driving no way can you live more islamically in the states than in Saudi Arabia.
when the issue of women arises people have the view that Saudi's are heartless wife beaters, you can ask my wife if this is true, my father has been with my mother more than 40 years, she was orphaned at the tender age of 1 week, so she has no brothers or father to protect her, my father by her own admission has never raised his voice or his hand at her, while i have heard her shout at him a few times but only a few times :), may Allah forgive us all, my sisters where always treated better than us, when i forwarded my and my brothers observations to my dad he said: Daughters are like guests, you bring them up and then they end up in another house, you should treat them like guests, with more tolerance and compassion, while you aint going no where now hit the floor and give me 100 push ups, hehehe
most men i know are the same, most Saudi's contrary to what people think respect their women for a few simple reasons:
1- Religion: we may not be the perfect nation but many people fear Allah.
2- Family: the families here are large, you take us for example, we are an everage family, 6 boys and 3 girls, 2 of my sisters are married, their husbands will think twice before disrespecting them.

As for the system as i said in my post above it does make it hard for families not just for women, because when women are not allowed to drive it affects us too!

Finally may Allah bless you and your family and gather you in Janna like he brought you together in this life, ameen.

Edited by Hamzah - 13 June 2008 at 3:44am
"Whosoever fears Allah, he will appoint for him a way out, and provide for him from where he does not expect"
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mariyah
 
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Quote mariyah Replybullet Posted: 13 June 2008 at 9:17am
Asalaamu alaikum Brother Hamzah,
May Allah reward you in this life and the next for your campassion and kindness.
Yes I was there in 1975 as a 17 year old. My father worked for the US state dept (as a closet revert Muslim) He took Myself and my brother there for Umrah once he had clearance to travel off the embassy area. It was a unique experience.
1. No where in my post did I knock Saudi arabia. You are a culture apart from others, and I was forced to wear an abaya there, where I can CHOOSE to wear an abaya here. That is the difference. There may be culural differences in the way different ethnic group live their faith. I found saudi to be beautiful, but it was a unique experience.
2. I was born in Ankara, Turkey, in the year 1958 so I am not of such a "western origin." We returned to the US when I was fifeen so adjusting to a life here was difficult for my younger sister an brother and myself as well as my mother who is a descendant of the Ottomans. I wear Hijab here because it is a commandment from Allah, and it is a choice, not a law of the land.
3. I know the women are treated well, but are they allowed to travel without an escort? I am just asking because things have changed over the years I am sure and I would like to know before I go back next year. I prefer to  travel with a companion but if it is a trip over 100 miles I choose to have one to follow "the rules".( I am referring to travel here)
Also, I do not have to have a letter of permission from my husband or nearest male member to travel her in the west. In contrast, I knew one widowed sister who had to get permission from the son she materially supported in college to write a letter of permission for her to go with a group for Haj. That is the difference.
The US is far from perfect, as Turkey and its customs were, but here we have to learn to live with people of other faiths, much as they did in Islamic Spain.
Some of your countrymen have not given a good impression of your country when they would come to the US as students and live here while attending universities. I know of 3 sisters that are of local origin whose first husbands were Saudi students and were abandoned with children when their husbands finished their educations and returned to their homelands to marry the wives chosen by family. They were never heard of again and some of the children have grown up fatherless. Guess an "English" wife is less worthy to some men that Saudi women. Not all saudi brothers who come here and marry have done so, but a disturbingly large proportion do so. And these are Muslim women and  children they are leaving behind.
Yes the west is full of corruption and whorehouses and gambling halls, but we just have to work harder to follow the commandments of Allah.
 
 
 


Edited by mariyah - 13 June 2008 at 9:44am
"Every good deed is charity whether you come to your brother's assistance or just greet him with a smile.
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Chrysalis
 
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Quote Chrysalis Replybullet Posted: 13 June 2008 at 9:47pm
Originally posted by Saladin

 Salaam brother,

 I undertand your frustration at your country being targeted for criticism, sometimes falsely but i dont think Saudi gets anymore than the US or China get. Reason is that Saudi is the birthplace of Islam and there's always going to be attention. When you get something wrong, for some motivated along religious, sectarian and racist lines, its a chance to get a shot at you. Some criticize coz it may be against their standards of rights and equality. For some, me included, wanting to see Saudi as the ideal Islamic state, do it because we perceive your mistakes as not befitting the ideal Islamic state. That said i dont think anyone else is any better or holier than the Saudis. Brother, i've heard and read of some amazingly good things about Saudi and its people, by people, muslims and non muslims who have lived there, for which i could find no parallel anywhere else. Sadly these dont make it to mainstream news.
 
Put very nicely. I Agree! Smile
"O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young."
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Quote Chrysalis Replybullet Posted: 13 June 2008 at 10:00pm
Originally posted by Hamzah

i think they enjoy using us as their Chauffeurs
 
Big%20smile
 
I think that is true! Though my country has no restrictions on female drivers, I prefer to be DRIVEN around rather than drive myself. Heh heh. And I think most men AND women would perfer to have someone else drive them around. . .
  So, if we look at it from another persepective, I would think that the victims of the drive-ban are men as well! :p because they HAVE to drive  thier women around! and act as Chauffeurs.
 
Also, I personally think that many (not all) saudi  women don't infact mind the ban at all. And they dont even consider themselves a victim. Since they have one less thing to do. . . and it is us non-saudis that seem to mind the ban more! lol. Again, it probably has to do a lot with the logic behind the ban rather than the ban itself.
 
And I would agree, that most arabs (and muslims) actually respect thier women a lot. Just like Br Hamza explained in his post. Thier needs are always catered to, and thier decisions in the house actually end up mattering MORE than the mens'. Also as children, daughters are often treated with more care. E.g the parents may often smack thier sons, but in a lot of houses, smacking daughters is considered unkind :p
"O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young."
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Quote Hayfa Replybullet Posted: 14 June 2008 at 3:44am
I have chauffeurs.. called the bus drivers.. Smile
 
Yeah.. if you are Saudi citizen things are quite good..
When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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